>"To his son G. residing at Orleans P. of Besangon sends
greeting with paternal zeal. It is written, ' He also that is slothful
in his work is brother to him that is a great waster.' I have recently
discovered that you live dissolutely and slothfully, preferring license
to restraint and play to work and strumming a guitar while the others
are at their studies, whence it happens that you have read but one
volume of law while your more industrious companions have read
several. Wherefore I have decided to exhort you herewith to re-
pent utterly of your dissolute and careless ways, that you may no
longer be called a waster and your shame may be turned to good
repute."
This could literally have happened in modern times just with modern language. Dude, skipped reading his books and played guitar instead. Quite literally a classic slacker!
That's incredible. The only difference between letters dads write to their college kids now and this letter is phrasing.
This is nowhere near as long ago, but in one of Jane Austen's novels, written about 220 years ago, two college aged characters talk about how much students drink. The male character, a college student, is bragging about how much he drinks and the female character is not impressed at all. It's a conversation everyone now has had, and has listened to, at least 10,000 times before they graduate.
>In the models of Ponce de Provence we find a teacher writing to
a student's father that while the young man is doing well in his
studies, he is just a trifle wild and would be helped by judicious ad-
monition. Naturally the master does not wish it known that the in-
formation came through him, so the father writes his son:
>" I have learned-not from your master, although he ought not
to hide such things from me, but from a certain trustworthy source
-that you do not study in your room or act in the schools as a
good student should, but play and wander about, disobedient to your
master and indulging in sport and in certain other dishonorable
practices which I do not now care to explain by letter." Then follow the usual extortations to reform.
This article from Medievalists.net details examples of correspondence of university students being in financial difficulties to their parents asking for more money.
Wide-Read1449 | 12 hours ago
Welp I guess college students really haven’t changed that much then ;)
I_am_BrokenCog | 12 hours ago
mayhap their needs remain the same, yet ever their mode of discourse decline.
horangiwhakkatchi | 11 hours ago
'Without Ceres and Bacchus, Apollo grows cold'.
That's a great line.
Today I imagine it's 'I'm lowkey starving fam. I can't study on an empty stomach. '
SchillMcGuffin | 7 hours ago
That really specifies that his pursuit of the arts requires bread and wine.
[OP] WanderingHero8 | 11 hours ago
And here is a paternal reply:
>"To his son G. residing at Orleans P. of Besangon sends greeting with paternal zeal. It is written, ' He also that is slothful in his work is brother to him that is a great waster.' I have recently discovered that you live dissolutely and slothfully, preferring license to restraint and play to work and strumming a guitar while the others are at their studies, whence it happens that you have read but one volume of law while your more industrious companions have read several. Wherefore I have decided to exhort you herewith to re- pent utterly of your dissolute and careless ways, that you may no longer be called a waster and your shame may be turned to good repute."
nooshdog | 11 hours ago
This could literally have happened in modern times just with modern language. Dude, skipped reading his books and played guitar instead. Quite literally a classic slacker!
0dty0 | 10 hours ago
You can almost hear Wonderwall, and everyone in the dorm preparing to lynch him for playing it.
Holly_kat | 10 hours ago
That's incredible. The only difference between letters dads write to their college kids now and this letter is phrasing.
This is nowhere near as long ago, but in one of Jane Austen's novels, written about 220 years ago, two college aged characters talk about how much students drink. The male character, a college student, is bragging about how much he drinks and the female character is not impressed at all. It's a conversation everyone now has had, and has listened to, at least 10,000 times before they graduate.
[OP] WanderingHero8 | 10 hours ago
Another case,from the paper I linked:
>In the models of Ponce de Provence we find a teacher writing to a student's father that while the young man is doing well in his studies, he is just a trifle wild and would be helped by judicious ad- monition. Naturally the master does not wish it known that the in- formation came through him, so the father writes his son:
>" I have learned-not from your master, although he ought not to hide such things from me, but from a certain trustworthy source -that you do not study in your room or act in the schools as a good student should, but play and wander about, disobedient to your master and indulging in sport and in certain other dishonorable practices which I do not now care to explain by letter." Then follow the usual extortations to reform.
Yglorba | 9 hours ago
His "I didn't learn this from your master" letter is raising a lot of questions already answered by his letter.
I_am_BrokenCog | 4 hours ago
super!
only, it's Licentiousness ... not license??
[OP] WanderingHero8 | 3 hours ago
I copied the text from the paper.
I_am_BrokenCog | an hour ago
strange. thanks!
Jorji-the-Trainer | 12 hours ago
I love the video of the "kids these days are lazy" where it has been a historical factor of humanity
Zeningo | 11 hours ago
Some things are constant! We also have this older letter from another student.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Letter_from_Iddin-Sin_to_Zinu
jean_nizzle | 10 hours ago
“In spite of the fact that you bore me and his mother only adopted him, his mother loves him, while you, you do not love me!”
Damn, kid. That’s cold.
PM_ME_SUMDICK | 3 hours ago
All because he felt like his clothes weren't up to par. Kids don't change.
[OP] WanderingHero8 | 13 hours ago
This article from Medievalists.net details examples of correspondence of university students being in financial difficulties to their parents asking for more money.
[OP] WanderingHero8 | 12 hours ago
To add,here is the paper this article is referencing,free on JSTOR.