No, probably HN or Reddit are better places to discuss hiring practices. If that's not appealing, that's probably strongly correlated with the fact that they're better places to discuss hiring practices than programming.
The thread was off to a bad start. 18 of the 22 comments were about business practices. I'm not going to spend my Friday night watching that thread like a hawk.
As the one who added the post, I appreciate seeing your reasoning for removing it and the link to the relevant guidelines. Will keep this in mind moving forward, as I tend to care about these kinds of headlines for the same reason that @conartist6 is asking for the post to be restored.
I wonder if a "news" tag could work, for "stories that won't be as interesting in a few years" - treated as an auxiliary tag that doesn't make a story topical by itself, but that applies a hotness modifier and can be filtered on.
Apart from being useful for filtering (which could be a nice experiment), it would make our preferences on this very visible, hopefully encouraging people to focus more on "timeless" stories.
Ah, you just shook a memory loose. This previously got suggested every couple months, but now I realize it's been years. Here's the last big thread on the idea.
I agree that the news should be on topic but your assessment is entirely wrong. cloudflare acquihiring deno was a mercy killing, not some evil conspiracy. they're not dismantling anything. the writing has been on the wall for months, maybe even years.
Well we've yet to see the real outcome. Once their maintenance actually stops, will anyone else step up? Will they have a different vision? I'm one of the people who agreed that Deno made a mistake by deciding to (endlessly) chase Node compatibility. The moment they did that is the moment that I, as a library author, gave up on explicitly supporting their ecosystem. Why would I when I could just support the node ecosystem as the one universal standard? And if the Node ecosystem is the one universal standard supported everywhere, why would I waste any time with the parts of Deno that aren't parts of Node? So yeah I agree that they really expressed a vote of no confidence in their own experiment when they did that and put the writing on the wall for this day.
There are some good ideas in Deno and it's well engineered - but it ultimately is not solving big problems. It has been sucked into the gravity well of node compatibility, which forces it to behave exactly as Node does. Why reimplement Node? It works. Marginal performance or UX or security benefits are not enough.
In Hashicorp's case, the discussion around the ramifications of the aquisition occured via the OpenTofu and OpenBao forks being discussed on the site in a much more "topical" fashion. My expectation that given the news is less than a day old (at the time of writing), we will see submissions which are more in line with the discussions that were had around OpenTofu and OpenBao for Deno's projects once the community has had a chance to process the news and coordinate on responses.
I think this is a bit of a one-sided POV, so I'd like to share mine. I have been a Deno user, and loved its Web standards approach, but with both Node catching up, and Deno moving in Node's direction there was too little differentation. I agree with the poster in another comment: the writing has been on the wall for Deno.
I think CF's workers architecture is very good, and if that excellent team now works on making that a serious FLOSS offering, I think this is very good for the JS/Wasm ecosystem.
I agree with you about all this. Also it was really Bun not Node that was setting the pace. I might consider putting my own runtime into the field one of these days, as I have my own ideas about how to make it into a platform worth using.
pushcx | 23 hours ago
No, probably HN or Reddit are better places to discuss hiring practices. If that's not appealing, that's probably strongly correlated with the fact that they're better places to discuss hiring practices than programming.
The thread was off to a bad start. 18 of the 22 comments were about business practices. I'm not going to spend my Friday night watching that thread like a hawk.
As for news, I've been consistently negative on news, just to link a couple comments that are more than a decade old and the site definition of topicality that explicitly disclaims this exact topic.
andrewchou | 22 hours ago
As the one who added the post, I appreciate seeing your reasoning for removing it and the link to the relevant guidelines. Will keep this in mind moving forward, as I tend to care about these kinds of headlines for the same reason that @conartist6 is asking for the post to be restored.
dzwdz | 22 hours ago
I wonder if a "news" tag could work, for "stories that won't be as interesting in a few years" - treated as an auxiliary tag that doesn't make a story topical by itself, but that applies a hotness modifier and can be filtered on.
Apart from being useful for filtering (which could be a nice experiment), it would make our preferences on this very visible, hopefully encouraging people to focus more on "timeless" stories.
(I know we had a "news" tag, but it did something different)
pushcx | 21 hours ago
Ah, you just shook a memory loose. This previously got suggested every couple months, but now I realize it's been years. Here's the last big thread on the idea.
dzwdz | 21 hours ago
FWIW, that's not really the sort of story I had in mind - I was thinking e.g. Forging 1024-bit RSA signatures in nearly SNFS time (which I think is interesting as a current breakthrough, but won't be interesting in a decade unless you're a number theorist). Looking at recent stories, perhaps 64-Day Certificate Lifetimes Coming Feb 2027?
andyc | 17 hours ago
Yeah I agree from a practical perspective. The thread was full of "piling on" that reflects poorly on the community
lilac | 23 hours ago
I agree that the news should be on topic but your assessment is entirely wrong. cloudflare acquihiring deno was a mercy killing, not some evil conspiracy. they're not dismantling anything. the writing has been on the wall for months, maybe even years.
[OP] conartist6 | 10 hours ago
Well we've yet to see the real outcome. Once their maintenance actually stops, will anyone else step up? Will they have a different vision? I'm one of the people who agreed that Deno made a mistake by deciding to (endlessly) chase Node compatibility. The moment they did that is the moment that I, as a library author, gave up on explicitly supporting their ecosystem. Why would I when I could just support the node ecosystem as the one universal standard? And if the Node ecosystem is the one universal standard supported everywhere, why would I waste any time with the parts of Deno that aren't parts of Node? So yeah I agree that they really expressed a vote of no confidence in their own experiment when they did that and put the writing on the wall for this day.
simonw | 7 hours ago
Ryan Dahl seems to agree with you:
355E3B | 22 hours ago
I would like to try to clarify my moderation stance around:
The post, as submitted, reads like a "report to market" similar to the one that Armon made when Hashicorp was aquired by IBM. While both companies clearly went their respective incredible journies, having discussions about the ramification and impact of this action on a submission which is explicitly called out as being off topic is off topic.
In Hashicorp's case, the discussion around the ramifications of the aquisition occured via the OpenTofu and OpenBao forks being discussed on the site in a much more "topical" fashion. My expectation that given the news is less than a day old (at the time of writing), we will see submissions which are more in line with the discussions that were had around OpenTofu and OpenBao for Deno's projects once the community has had a chance to process the news and coordinate on responses.
manuel | 11 hours ago
I think this is a bit of a one-sided POV, so I'd like to share mine. I have been a Deno user, and loved its Web standards approach, but with both Node catching up, and Deno moving in Node's direction there was too little differentation. I agree with the poster in another comment: the writing has been on the wall for Deno.
I think CF's workers architecture is very good, and if that excellent team now works on making that a serious FLOSS offering, I think this is very good for the JS/Wasm ecosystem.
[OP] conartist6 | 9 hours ago
I agree with you about all this. Also it was really Bun not Node that was setting the pace. I might consider putting my own runtime into the field one of these days, as I have my own ideas about how to make it into a platform worth using.