Telnyx was cool until they started demanding KYC. I would use them for burner phone numbers until they started saying they needed my government ID. Fuck that.
OVH same thing. Tried to buy a VPS from them some years back and they said no VPS unless I provided ID. Would not refund me. Tried to dispute but my bank just gave me a credit instead.
Seems like a good riddance, telnyx is for business usecases, not for personal use.
Such use would be incompatible because it would lure in fraud, which would ruin the reputation of shared comms resources like ip blocks, phone number blocks, etc..
If you are doing real business, you are providing KYC as a daily matter in procurement, thereby protecting consumers from Sybil scum.
No? Firstly you can't do a Sybil attack when each identity costs actual resources, and secondly you can still have lots of phone numbers, they just know who each one belongs to.
We've been fighting this battle with the FCC. They tried fining us (and then dropped it), but they continue to push the issue via NPRMs. We generally think KYC is ineffective due to ID mules. It's obviously a privacy issue as well.
We estimate that the true blended price per million tokens for running Opus 4.7 on agentic tasks at $0.99 despite the sticker price being $5/$25 per MTok.
They're not saying anything about Anthropic serving costs in that quote, just calculating what MTok price is for running agents. Next sentence after your quote:
> Agentic workloads have extremely high input-to-output ratios (our Claude Code usage has a ratio of about 300:1) and high cache hit rates (90%+). Because cached input tokens only cost $0.50/MTok, most of the tokens end up in the cheapest tier.
90% cache hit input blend: 0.9 * $0.5 + 0.1 * $5 = $0.95 per MTok.
Please correct me if I'm incorrect, but it seems to me those numbers are describing a fairly different situation to this one. Anthropic serving their own model to their own users at that scale gets cache hit rates and machine utilisation that someone standing up another company's 2.8T model in four regions isn't going to get, and this thing needs 64 accelerators minimum before it will run at all, so a rack sitting mostly idle through a quiet hour costs the same as a busy one. The margin figure quoted is also just the price against the cost of producing the tokens, it doesn't have buying the hardware in it, or depreciation, or maintenance, or the money they'd have made renting those machines out instead, which with rental prices up 40% since October isn't nothing.
I largely agree things are overpriced, I just don't think that article is the right basis for saying it about this one.
I think telnyx is a good product, with the only stain to its name being the supply chain attack on their python library.
But I don't feel like providing inference is a professional move, it feels like out of scope for a telephony IaaS company. Feels like a FOMO moment where a reputation of years is crashed in a couple of weekends of being drawn into a fad.
And the fact that it's a chinese model doesn't quite help? I guess it's on brand with the 'cheap' pay as you go brand telnyx might already be associated to.
But more so it reads like Telnyx is trying to 'jump' into the trend of the 'open weights' discussion to compete with closed source incumbents. But we are at the tail end of the boom, anti ai sentiment is ever growing, customers now despise AI, especially in support channels, which is presumably the hook that Telnyx would have into 'AI'(LLMs). At this stage any company or individual that tries to join into the buzzword fueled cycle will pay the full fixed cost reputational price, but only reap the leftover hay from when the sun shone.
AI(LLM) on support channels is essentially a decapitalization of a company/brand, the company has a reputation that customers value, and might be worth good money in the market, and by implementing AI (LLMs) on support, a lot of costs can be cut, while the brand loses value, not sustainable. And by Telnyx (or any B2B company)asking their clients to participate in this decapitalization move, they essentially gamble their reputation as well, albeit with better odds as shovel sellers.
Large profitable corporations with very poor customer support have existed long before AI, so why should it be different? Using AI to provide poor customer service is just an implementation detail.
Companies changing their scope or opening side products is not at all unusual. Microsoft is Windows, what's this Xbox thing? Google is search, why do they have email? Y Combinator is a startup accelerator, why'd they make their own Reddit?
Yeah, the pypi thing sucked, and we've taken the necessary measures to prevent something like that from happening again.
We're moving past "telephony" and focusing on building more agentic primitives at the telecom edge.
This isn't a recent jump. We've been on this path for some time.
Disagree with you on the customer support side and re: decapitalization in general. People will want to talk to competent bots. We have people literally prompting our AI agents (which are capable of doing troubleshooting) in our shared Slack channels. You simply cannot beat the speed with which they can provide a quality response.
We remain committed to delivering the highest quality product at the lowest possible price point - across all of our product lines.
> Just a quick heads-up — I'm Claude, made by Anthropic, not Kimi! Kimi is a different AI assistant (made by Moonshot AI), so it looks like there might be a little mix-up.
when open source models are banned maybe i will become a cartel kingpin smuggling open source weights into the usa. find a sufficiently shifty street corner, 'what do you need', "kimi". are you familiar with my product? pure mxfp4, $500 per TB.
(joke and walter mitty, i know the government reads my messages)
Models don't have an inherent identity. It should be obvious by now that every models trains on public AI chat session transcripts. I've seen Claude say it's Qwen.
I remember when Claude identified as ChatGPT a long time ago. It proves nothing else than that there is a lot of training material on the internet with Claude as the AI.
I don't understand why labs don't include correct model name in the training process. Almost nobody seems to be willing to tell their models who they actually are.
If the model works correctly, you don't need to include the model name in the training process. You just add in the system prompt "You are X, trained by Y" and the model will claim to be that. That also allows users to "white-label" the outputs sort to say.
This approach is basically how all "models know who they are" (they don't actually typically "know" that at all), it's just a system prompt instruction in the platform you use.
That only makes sense if you don't sell access to the model for 3rd party product development. One of those products is chat personas/agents. The company integrating the model will want it's own identity.
You can put anything in the prompt. And if you have bare model that you don't give any prompt from the start and want to find out which model you are talking to, you are out of luck.
I think Qwen teaches its models that they are Qwen. Most others don't bother.
Because they do not know the name of the model before they train it. There is also distillation, where multiple models will be trained from a larger one. E.G. Sonnet was promoted to Opus at one point after it surpassed expectations.
I have used Telnyx for, on the opposite end of cool-ness, their fax API. Curious if their AI pricing and quality are actually competitive or if this is just a rapid pivot to try to ride the AI wave.
It's not a rapid pivot. We've been doing AI stuff for quite some time, particularly on the voice side. Soon, you'll see more from us on the physical AI side. Our GPUs are colocated next to our mobile core, so as we roll out vision models, you'll be able to do things like agentically pilot drones with low latency.
That is not going to be cheap for long if K3 prices does the same as GLM5.2 prices. If nothing else open weight models are great to get providers to compeete on price.
Do you guys provide ZDR? We’ve been waiting for someone to offer inference in Sydney on decent GPUs for a while but we’ve got strict no logging or retention requirements.
buffer_overlord | 22 hours ago
smallerize | 22 hours ago
LoganDark | 19 hours ago
OVH same thing. Tried to buy a VPS from them some years back and they said no VPS unless I provided ID. Would not refund me. Tried to dispute but my bank just gave me a credit instead.
nujabe | 16 hours ago
oxidant | 12 hours ago
illliillll | 14 hours ago
tomr75 | 13 hours ago
TZubiri | 13 hours ago
Such use would be incompatible because it would lure in fraud, which would ruin the reputation of shared comms resources like ip blocks, phone number blocks, etc..
If you are doing real business, you are providing KYC as a daily matter in procurement, thereby protecting consumers from Sybil scum.
inigyou | 11 hours ago
No? Firstly you can't do a Sybil attack when each identity costs actual resources, and secondly you can still have lots of phone numbers, they just know who each one belongs to.
contactdq | 5 hours ago
jakswa | 19 hours ago
NitpickLawyer | 16 hours ago
trollbridge | 5 hours ago
teravor | 18 hours ago
gruez | 18 hours ago
alexeldeib | 18 hours ago
rubslopes | 18 hours ago
teravor | 17 hours ago
according to Semianalysis those prices would be far above actual costs.
FergusArgyll | 17 hours ago
Not the **literal** cost
tpm | 13 hours ago
petu | 13 hours ago
> Agentic workloads have extremely high input-to-output ratios (our Claude Code usage has a ratio of about 300:1) and high cache hit rates (90%+). Because cached input tokens only cost $0.50/MTok, most of the tokens end up in the cheapest tier.
90% cache hit input blend: 0.9 * $0.5 + 0.1 * $5 = $0.95 per MTok.
300:1 input/output blend: (300 * $0.95 + $25) / 301 = $1.03 per MTok.
They don't say exact cache hit rate they calculated for ("90%+"), so close enough.
Grimblewald | 11 hours ago
I largely agree things are overpriced, I just don't think that article is the right basis for saying it about this one.
theredsix | 18 hours ago
norbert515 | 11 hours ago
Mossy9 | 14 hours ago
€2.693/M input €13.464/M output Surprisingly, cache is not mentioned
Upd: Tensorix joined the fray, with the same prices, with cache at €0.673/M read
bedros | 13 hours ago
vdfs | 10 hours ago
contactdq | 5 hours ago
madhu_ghalame | 13 hours ago
TZubiri | 13 hours ago
But I don't feel like providing inference is a professional move, it feels like out of scope for a telephony IaaS company. Feels like a FOMO moment where a reputation of years is crashed in a couple of weekends of being drawn into a fad.
And the fact that it's a chinese model doesn't quite help? I guess it's on brand with the 'cheap' pay as you go brand telnyx might already be associated to.
But more so it reads like Telnyx is trying to 'jump' into the trend of the 'open weights' discussion to compete with closed source incumbents. But we are at the tail end of the boom, anti ai sentiment is ever growing, customers now despise AI, especially in support channels, which is presumably the hook that Telnyx would have into 'AI'(LLMs). At this stage any company or individual that tries to join into the buzzword fueled cycle will pay the full fixed cost reputational price, but only reap the leftover hay from when the sun shone.
AI(LLM) on support channels is essentially a decapitalization of a company/brand, the company has a reputation that customers value, and might be worth good money in the market, and by implementing AI (LLMs) on support, a lot of costs can be cut, while the brand loses value, not sustainable. And by Telnyx (or any B2B company)asking their clients to participate in this decapitalization move, they essentially gamble their reputation as well, albeit with better odds as shovel sellers.
jbstack | 12 hours ago
inigyou | 11 hours ago
trollbridge | 5 hours ago
contactdq | 5 hours ago
We're moving past "telephony" and focusing on building more agentic primitives at the telecom edge.
This isn't a recent jump. We've been on this path for some time.
Disagree with you on the customer support side and re: decapitalization in general. People will want to talk to competent bots. We have people literally prompting our AI agents (which are capable of doing troubleshooting) in our shared Slack channels. You simply cannot beat the speed with which they can provide a quality response.
We remain committed to delivering the highest quality product at the lowest possible price point - across all of our product lines.
rvz | 13 hours ago
inigyou | 11 hours ago
neuroticnews25 | 10 hours ago
philjohn | 7 hours ago
zius | 13 hours ago
> Hi there! Quick note — I'm actually Claude, made by Anthropic, not Kimi. But no worries!
https://imgur.com/a/jqpc2Jc
and
> Just a quick heads-up — I'm Claude, made by Anthropic, not Kimi! Kimi is a different AI assistant (made by Moonshot AI), so it looks like there might be a little mix-up.
https://imgur.com/a/AKxeysH
TZubiri | 12 hours ago
Grimblewald | 12 hours ago
victorbjorklund | 11 hours ago
croes | 10 hours ago
lukewarm707 | 9 hours ago
(joke and walter mitty, i know the government reads my messages)
FooBarWidget | 12 hours ago
nojs | 12 hours ago
Razengan | 9 hours ago
cleaning | 12 hours ago
tomashubelbauer | 12 hours ago
victorbjorklund | 11 hours ago
scotty79 | 8 hours ago
embedding-shape | 8 hours ago
This approach is basically how all "models know who they are" (they don't actually typically "know" that at all), it's just a system prompt instruction in the platform you use.
brookst | 8 hours ago
XenophileJKO | 7 hours ago
scotty79 | 8 hours ago
I think Qwen teaches its models that they are Qwen. Most others don't bother.
irthomasthomas | 7 hours ago
croes | 10 hours ago
Razengan | 8 hours ago
w4yai | 7 hours ago
maelito | 13 hours ago
mkl | 7 hours ago
The top text says MENA as well, but the regions page doesn't mention it.
maelito | 2 hours ago
mesmertech | 10 hours ago
Or does openrouter have like a specific contract you have to sign with them and requirements or smth? https://openrouter.ai/moonshotai/kimi-k3#providers
hmokiguess | 9 hours ago
DaSHacka | 8 hours ago
hmokiguess | 7 hours ago
ljlolel | 6 hours ago
addandsubtract | 6 hours ago
morpheuskafka | 9 hours ago
trollbridge | 5 hours ago
contactdq | 5 hours ago
tokai | 9 hours ago
hmokiguess | 9 hours ago
apexalpha | 9 hours ago
Why is this provider specifically on the front page?
Also why is this not available over openrouter?
heisgone | 8 hours ago
contactdq | 5 hours ago
ljlolel | 6 hours ago
blackoil | 5 hours ago
contactdq | 5 hours ago
We've been trying to get on OpenRouter. Just reached out to their CEO. Would be great if people could request it as well.
We're unique in that we have B300 in USA, EU, UAE, and AUS.
Also, building out other agentic primitives like stateful actors (in beta, but will be rolled out globally in the coming weeks):
https://developers.telnyx.com/docs/edge-compute/stateful-act...
Also, if you're doing things agentically, check out AI repo:
https://github.com/team-telnyx/ai
ivanvanderbyl | 27 minutes ago
htrp | 8 hours ago
Looks like they are first vendor to undercut in price.