We'll be dealing with this for decades. American science is being kneecapped and we will have far fewer scientists for the foreseeable future as so many cuts to early career grad students and post docs get fired and don't become senior researchers. The loss of competitiveness, the discoveries not made will be difficult to quantify but we are clearly on the wrong side of history.
Science/Philosophy is the antithesis of Ideology. The former is the search for answers. In the latter you are given the answers. There's no need for science if you're worldview has all the answers.
While Republicans are in charge, you guys aren't going to have any choice.
People aren't realising that a Conservative Party in politics is not the same as being conservative in a budget (for example).
A Conservative Party is a party that wants a Classist System -
Politicians and the rich are the Ruling class :
they make the rules but aren't expected to follow those same rules.
The working class:
You are there to serve the politicians and the rich but are not to have rights and must pay for the privilege of benefitting them.
The rest of society:
You have no rights and only exist to benefit the 'ruling class'.
In a Classist System, education, innovation, science etc has no place BUT religion, subservience by the people and dominance by the ruling class is expected.
The only way you guys are going to be able to turn this around is to get the Republicans AND any other Conservative Party out of Politics ...for good.
This 'right wing movement' around the world is Conservative Parties wanting to drag us back to medievil times.
And the worst part, despite this not being a part of the article/post, is that there is a general worldwide push rightward. It fucking sucks, and we'll continue to do so until we address the very large elephant in the room called neoliberal policy.
It’s the social media algorithms and the media being captured & consolidated by a small number of conservative owners that is creating the worldwide push rightward.
It’s what he said plus the scarcity of resources, impacted and made worse by climate change, leading to socioeconomic inequalities and immigration from country x to country y just to survive, then leading to a pushback in nationalism as people (middle class up through rich) NIMBY the way of life and lifestyles they were used to. So nationalism is on the rise globally
It’s because a lot of people are stupid. It’s not unique to one country, we are a flawed species and probably destined to die out. I have no faith in humanity especially after we elected the orange stain twice. Perhaps we will somehow magically overcome propaganda and the rich controlling everything, but I doubt it.
All the while telling you that with AI you won't have to work anymore instead of telling you that they mean the overlords won't have to give you employment.
Also, the overlords won’t have to *pay you* for employment. You know, like how Trump stiffs workers and vendors.
I remember when a woman said to George W. Bush that she had to work 3 jobs to feed her family. Bush’s response: “That’s wonderful! How uniquely American.”
They want to push research out of universities and into the private sector. Ultimately that is the end goal for everything republicans are doing. Research, USPS, medicaid, social security. Push it all into the private sector where it can make the rich, richer.
A lot of basic research used to be conducted by private companies in the US, Bell Labs being the most famous example. But basic research became more difficult to justify as “maximizing shareholder value” became the religious mantra in C suites and Wall St in the 1980s. Short term thinking. The government had been increasing basic science support since the Cold War and even through GOP and Dem administrations for decades because it made a lot of sense for the government to spend money on these long term investments. We’re never going to go back to basic science being supported by private companies, and even if they did they were never anywhere near the level that government could afford and justify to spend.
This! Basic research in industry has been off loaded to government funded programs. This was done through a combination of tax disincentives on profits and as the previous commenter says an expectation on returns for investors. Consequently all risk of basic research is on the government to train a research workforce and produce new ideas and techniques. While industry does do R&D it isn’t basic of throwing ideas against a wall to see what sticks. Loss of the education and basic R&D pipeline will affect return on investment in 5-10 years when the slowdown really causes a loss of new technologies and development of new markets. Industry doesn’t exist on that timeframe.
Also companies won't likely invest in rare diseases.
Say goodbye to cures for paralysis if we put the burden of development exclusively into industry.
Not to mention the academic platform of sharing knowledge reduces redundancy, increases competition, and expidites treatment developments, all of which should be valued by capitalists.
It’s shifting from data and discovery driven to money driven. The soulless world of accounting has no use for the enthusiasm of finding a new species, particle, medicine, technique, equation, etc.
It’s a mediocrity generator for science. Make it worth something NOW, or it won’t get funded.
Just don’t tell the statisticians there is someone more dry and stoic than they are. You’ll never be able to prove anything was discovered at all after they pick up the truth and stalk out the door with it! LOL! 🤣
There is a book, “What Went Wrong: The Clash Between Islam and Modernity in the Middle East,” that analyzes how the Middle East lost its place as a global center of power as Europe moved from the Renaissance into modernity. The role of religion in politics and civil society and the inability to adapt rather than blame external forces for the disparity of outcomes very closely match what Christian Nationalists and Evangelicals are doing here in the US.
We need to come to grips with the fact that a LARGE portion of our population wants the Christian version of Sharia law, the WANT wealth inequality and top down government that aligns with their understanding of the world, and their morality is not based on any kind of objective analysis of impacts and outcomes it’s simply what their leaders tell them it is.
They are delusional and they are a threat to our future (not the least because over half of them want to see the end of the goddamned world).
I’m a little cautious of that book’s premise as that assumes that Europe and the Middle East were consistently distinct economic blocs, and for much of history it wasn’t. The Roman empire was not a European empire so much as a Mediterranean one, and that meant occupying much of southern Europe and the Middle East. Same with Byzantine. Middle Ages Europe and Middle East were deeply intertwined as centres of knowledge often intersected between Christian and Islamic lands, such as Roger III’s Italy, or ambiguous European-ness of the Ottomans.
Republicans have fucked the US for at least a generation in almost every measurable dimension. I hope the US eventually recovers, but it won't happen in my lifetime. It's sad.
Lysenkoism is a virus introduced into the USA by the anti-intellectual, Libertarian, anti-democracy cohort.
Just as Russia dealt with starvation for decades due to crop failure as a direct result of Lysenkoism, the USA will be crippled and weakened for decades (or longer) as a result of the anti-science attack from within.
Science disproves almost every single right wing belief so they told their hog voters that science is woke and gay. The dumbest people in the universe run the country now.
The general public really doesn't understand or doesn't care how bad this situation is. As scientists we're in a lose-lose situation. We can sound the alarms but it doesn't reach the people it needs to. To them, the reality of the situation and content of what we say doesnt matter. We are just anti trump and mad that we lost our 'pet project' funding. This is decades of anti-intellictualism coming to full fruition and I honestly don't know how we can recover. I consider myself to be lucky as many of my colleagues had their careers essentially evaporate over the past year, and they are struggling to find jobs and might not be able to get back into research. But everyday dealing with the bullshit is getting tiring. Figuring out what to do with projects that got grants cut, rewriting maga fanfiction into project narratives and proposals to get funded, as well as being political scapegoats is exhausting.
They also blame these same grandkids for racking up student loan debt after spending decades telling them that a college education was the key to making money.
Reminds me of the sopranos when AJ says maybe there’s no god and his parents freak out. And Meadow says “you guys want him to get education, this is what education does. You think it just means more money”
The right either doesn’t know or doesn’t care what science and stem are actually for. The rubes just know it means more money for the grandkids. The elites just want better workers to carry out their insane projects.
I don't want to dox myself and give specifics, but as someone who is a peer reviewer for a major grant program this is already the case. This rule change would enshrine what is already happening now.
What nonsense. It’s using all kinds of unrelated programs available for the general population to justify restriction of grants going to major universities, etc under solid review by professionals.
You would think that the millions of dollars being used to remove deep water sensors so no one can ever use the technology again would wake someone up.
But no. It’s not good enough to simply not collect the data. We have to remove the hardware that’s is doing nothing from the ocean floor. 🙄
You should be. This is reddit. I'm a chemist and I work in biobased chemicals and materials. My account is hidden because I'm paranoid of getting doxed, and eventually I will nuke this account and start a fresh account with a new username. That's just the way I use social media.
No problem. By the way, you don't have to take my word for it. There are numerous reporters covering what science is like at federal institutions, universities, and as a whole in the US currently. This scientific American series is a good one since it tells some personal stories that give some of these numbers context- but what I described is widely reported and documented.
$202 billion spent in 2025 for federal R&D spend. The highest ever. A $187 billion budget for 2026. A 6% cut.
Who rewrote what for funding? DEI anything having to be removed after being introduced a few years ago? ESG before that? And…so a less than ten year old practice had to stop?
Look it’s not the right decision fine. The sky isn’t falling.
Rewriting and writing new proposals to fit with the presidents policies. Getting funded is now less about fitting in with the mission of the funding agency and more about aligning to the administrations policy proposals. There are terms that are soft banned and result in applications getting flagged. It's not just DEI, but that has inadvertently stopped funding for things ranting from sickle cell research to biodiversity. This is what I've dealt with both writing and peer reviewing proposals, and it's well reported on by several outlets. Scientist have always had to go with the ebb and flow of funding, but what is happening now is fundamentally different from how it's worked throughout the scientifically landscape of the past 70 years. Frankly, I assume you have no idea what the current scientific landscape is like in the public sector if you aren't aware of this. You don't know what you're talking about and should read about what has been happening.
Exactly, for example that dumbass Elon and Doge cut $15M a year in screwworm prevention measures, Trump just announced $1B to fight the outbreak. Every cut is resulting in massive newly incurred costs.
I can't even count how many times I had to explain how much money and time it would have costs to estimate the actual downstream costs of eliminating funding across the entire federal government.
Biden was getting destroyed for having what was the globals best economy coming out of covid but their was somewhat high inflation which was, at least in my eyes, understandable.
Yet not a peep from media now that trump is derailing the economy and causing inflation to go up. Its like a "well everything is awful now, but what ya gonna do? ¯\(ツ)/¯"
Everyone has bent the knee, because the brain dead US voters keep voting for Trump's regime. Why would anyone bother resisting anymore? Clearly they'll accomplish nothing except become targets for revenge.
It was their whole pitch after all. Outside of their blatent power grab and wealth transfer, fElon and his crew of methheads had to pick on some small fries to maintain the illusion that they were doing something. And why not pick on those nerd scientists that the trailer trash red hats already hate?
The consequences of underfunding will amplify what is already happening. As a Stroke neurologist, several recent pivotal trials for stroke management have come out of China, and not the United States.
If not eventually taking the lead, China is at least establishing itself as a frontline innovator who can bring major developments to the rest of the world. That will pull talent away from the U.S.
Even from a purely pro US viewpoint it doesn't make sense. Science is something we actually have a competitive advantage at. We've been the scientific leaders of the world since post ww2 and we've attracted top talent from around the world to study in our country instead if their homes. We've been the defacto leaders of several international organizations and scientific committees and have exerted a lot of influence in that way. Now we've left a void for China or the EU to fill. It's a completely self inflicted self own. One of the real industry's that could've brought manufacturing jobs back was in biomanufacturing and biotech. Supply chains and infrastructure for manufacturing new medicines, new consumer products, and ither new bioproducts will likely build out in China over the next decade. It's already started, but this basically cements us as losers in this space.
Yes. Science transcends borders and those in the scientific community are still cooperating with international partners. Advancements will continue to happen here, albeit at a much slower pace. Sadly capitalism and profits will decimate our ability to wage wars of discovery for years to come. We're entering an age of stupidification. Too much reliance on AI and computers for all the wrong things.
Yep. Obvious statements often surprise me, so when China said "we've been around for thousands of years and will survive..." lol. I knew they are hardly concerned with us.
Sad that after 250 years this country still acts like a bunch of infant mini-nations that can't seem to grasp, lifting up your neighbors and everyone brings national prosperity to all.
>America’s compact between science and politics is broken
For the print version
>State of American Science
Both have "U.S. science is in chaos" as the main alt title.
Regardless, both versions paint how dire the situation in US science has become in just a year in a half under an aggressively anti-science administration
Anyone who is working in anything science adjacent knows it's irreversible damage that's being done. We left the US, not because of Trump, but aren't going to ever come back because of him and the Americans who supported him by the tens of millions. So now you have the kids of two highly educated STEM parents growing up in Europe and guess where they'll be studying and then working?
Ya love to see it. I have similar feelings about the people of my homeland (US). Maybe your kids will have a libertarian rebel phase and go back to the US though.
Those programs are hiring a very small handful of scientists. When the DOGE stuff started, Denmark made an announcement about hiring American scientists, then when you looked into it, they were hiring ~100-200 people. Other countries launched recruiting programs as well, but the numbers weren’t much higher. American universities produced around 58,000 PhDs in 2024. These increases are a drop in the bucket relatively to the American research sector
As much as I loathe this admin and what they are doing to research, I do have to say that there are too many PhDs being generated. It has been a problem for over a decade, perhaps longer. Schools push out barely trained PhDs to feed the grist mill of postdoc labor. I spend too much time retraining them as postdocs and then they can't find positions resulting in them taking lab tech jobs that have traditionally been held by people with lesser degrees. It's an arms race of initials after names to get jobs. Almost all of this is caused by not enough funding for research. Universities can't keep PhD students long enough for proper training since the funds to carry them are limited. Labs need postdocs for cheaper labor because of the lack of funds for permanent positions. There is a glut of underutilized undertrained PhDs because they were sold a line about STEM but not supported by society.
Yes, similar to the problems in China with the Great Leap Forward, Stalin and the holodomor, Vietnam after the communists won, other famines where there were “distribution problems” with plenty of food available where governments used the excuse of “chaos or bad management” to destroy systems that keep society running so that people are more worried about survival than politics.
After WWII the US was busy making itself Great by spending tons of money on education from elementary through phd and starting social support programs like free lunch in schools and expanding global political influence with programs like usaid.
Now the US government is on a speed run to demolish all the pipelines that helped form, educate and support the people that made it great.
It’s gotta be purposeful and why aren’t the people in positions of power like senators trying to stop this dismantling.
Sure but if you say that "chaos" has "erupted" due to "DOGE budget hawks" it makes it seem as if by constraining the budget, scientists have been inadvertently flummoxed. Now we're picturing Doc Brown instead of wealthy oligarchs
They are taking food out of kids mouths, do you think they will respect something as abstract as science? They don’t understand it and don’t seem to care about anything that won’t make them richer in the short term.
There is a YouTube video by astrophysicist Angela Collier that goes into detail on the destruction of US science and the "Genesis Mission" program that has been instituted.
The long and short of it is that the entire public institution of science has been dismantled and the remains have been auctioned off to private companies through mandatory "industry partners" for all grants who own all IP and discoveries acquired through any subsequent research and development.
Oh, who needs lots of high paying jobs, worldwide prestige, having the foundation for knowledge and skills that will carry the country into the next century, or the scientific discoveries that would secure the future of the nation? Scientists can just learn Chinese, and have you seen the prices on mega yachts these days. This way some government official will be able to afford the gold trim, and isn't that what's truly important in this world?
> Last June the budget hawks in the Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE) pushed NASA into offering a broad package of buyouts, paid leave and early retirement. Over the next few weeks nearly 4,000 NASA employees—about a fifth of the workforce—took the deal.
I dont think people understand, How much Money is about/IS being Funneled into Red States.
Look at Alabama(has jumped allot in education stats where they put all this new funding) not saying its a bad but Blue states they are looking to make a funding desert so kids will choose States with Funding.
This has little to do with current politics though. Huntsville's Research Park began in the 1960s.
Huntsville has NASA and about 300 other government contractors. It's one of the most educated cities in the US. There are a lot of rocket scientists and aerospace engineers there.
You can fact check all of that. But the point is that you can't just redirect the funding to a Blue state and federal money isn't being 'funneled' to Alabama
Birmingham became a medical hub. Lots of money, lots of research. Med school and hospital that draws people from all over the world.
The rest of Alabama may be rural and inbred. Got to be honest though, some cities have rightfully earned federal funding
Americans pay more taxes with less to show for it. USA universities are in huge huge trouble and the only thing Congress has focused on is College Football.
Hanging with some friends recently who have a friend in CA that's a high level science professor at one of the UC programs. His research has been kneecapped and he's decided to retire to another country asap. This professor told our friends he's hearing a lot of science professors are pondering their future in America.
Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that the federal government is actively sabotaging it at every turn? Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that the current administration has fostered and benefited from stoking people's distrust of science and rewarded them emotionally for taking pride in their ignorance?
If anyone can recommend a country that pays it's PHD and master's STEM and science students a liveable wage, and respects as well as gives science a chance, i'd love to know. I'm a queer and trans STEM major in the US looking to get out and move to another country or study in another country. ❤️🏳️⚧️
rollem | 10 days ago
We'll be dealing with this for decades. American science is being kneecapped and we will have far fewer scientists for the foreseeable future as so many cuts to early career grad students and post docs get fired and don't become senior researchers. The loss of competitiveness, the discoveries not made will be difficult to quantify but we are clearly on the wrong side of history.
missbwith2boys | 10 days ago
The kneecapping is unspeakably horrible on so many levels. America has been about innovation and research and we are just…giving that up?
[OP] OrangeJr36 | 10 days ago
When you ascribe to an ideology that views impartial data and intelligence as a mortal threat, yes they are.
Economy_Zombie_3026 | 9 days ago
Science/Philosophy is the antithesis of Ideology. The former is the search for answers. In the latter you are given the answers. There's no need for science if you're worldview has all the answers.
Inevitable-Mud613 | 10 days ago
While Republicans are in charge, you guys aren't going to have any choice.
People aren't realising that a Conservative Party in politics is not the same as being conservative in a budget (for example).
A Conservative Party is a party that wants a Classist System -
Politicians and the rich are the Ruling class : they make the rules but aren't expected to follow those same rules.
The working class:
You are there to serve the politicians and the rich but are not to have rights and must pay for the privilege of benefitting them.
The rest of society:
You have no rights and only exist to benefit the 'ruling class'.
In a Classist System, education, innovation, science etc has no place BUT religion, subservience by the people and dominance by the ruling class is expected.
The only way you guys are going to be able to turn this around is to get the Republicans AND any other Conservative Party out of Politics ...for good.
This 'right wing movement' around the world is Conservative Parties wanting to drag us back to medievil times.
.
NonReality | 10 days ago
And the worst part, despite this not being a part of the article/post, is that there is a general worldwide push rightward. It fucking sucks, and we'll continue to do so until we address the very large elephant in the room called neoliberal policy.
Mohel_Streep | 10 days ago
It’s the social media algorithms and the media being captured & consolidated by a small number of conservative owners that is creating the worldwide push rightward.
NonReality | 10 days ago
That's certainty part of the problem, but it's also much larger than that
menghis_khan08 | 9 days ago
It’s what he said plus the scarcity of resources, impacted and made worse by climate change, leading to socioeconomic inequalities and immigration from country x to country y just to survive, then leading to a pushback in nationalism as people (middle class up through rich) NIMBY the way of life and lifestyles they were used to. So nationalism is on the rise globally
NonReality | 9 days ago
All of these are a direct result of neoliberal policies since the 80s lol
ActionJacksonATL24 | 9 days ago
It’s because a lot of people are stupid. It’s not unique to one country, we are a flawed species and probably destined to die out. I have no faith in humanity especially after we elected the orange stain twice. Perhaps we will somehow magically overcome propaganda and the rich controlling everything, but I doubt it.
charlie2135 | 10 days ago
All the while telling you that with AI you won't have to work anymore instead of telling you that they mean the overlords won't have to give you employment.
Inevitable-Mud613 | 10 days ago
💯
BalanceOrganic7735 | 10 days ago
Also, the overlords won’t have to *pay you* for employment. You know, like how Trump stiffs workers and vendors.
I remember when a woman said to George W. Bush that she had to work 3 jobs to feed her family. Bush’s response: “That’s wonderful! How uniquely American.”
Sea-Visual-6486 | 10 days ago
They want to push research out of universities and into the private sector. Ultimately that is the end goal for everything republicans are doing. Research, USPS, medicaid, social security. Push it all into the private sector where it can make the rich, richer.
Ghoulius-Caesar | 10 days ago
This is the impression I got with the DOGE cuts. It was Elon’s way of trying to privatize research so that his companies can have more patents.
rollem | 10 days ago
A lot of basic research used to be conducted by private companies in the US, Bell Labs being the most famous example. But basic research became more difficult to justify as “maximizing shareholder value” became the religious mantra in C suites and Wall St in the 1980s. Short term thinking. The government had been increasing basic science support since the Cold War and even through GOP and Dem administrations for decades because it made a lot of sense for the government to spend money on these long term investments. We’re never going to go back to basic science being supported by private companies, and even if they did they were never anywhere near the level that government could afford and justify to spend.
Harold_v3 | 10 days ago
This! Basic research in industry has been off loaded to government funded programs. This was done through a combination of tax disincentives on profits and as the previous commenter says an expectation on returns for investors. Consequently all risk of basic research is on the government to train a research workforce and produce new ideas and techniques. While industry does do R&D it isn’t basic of throwing ideas against a wall to see what sticks. Loss of the education and basic R&D pipeline will affect return on investment in 5-10 years when the slowdown really causes a loss of new technologies and development of new markets. Industry doesn’t exist on that timeframe.
TheTopNacho | 10 days ago
Also companies won't likely invest in rare diseases.
Say goodbye to cures for paralysis if we put the burden of development exclusively into industry.
Not to mention the academic platform of sharing knowledge reduces redundancy, increases competition, and expidites treatment developments, all of which should be valued by capitalists.
Lanky-Detail3380 | 10 days ago
Cost to much, china will rnd for us. Its all about next quarter numbers
OMG_IM_A_GIRL | 10 days ago
Not giving it up. That is passive. The current administration and the evangelical anti-intellectual backing it are actively sabotaging science.
MEDICARE_FOR_ALL | 10 days ago
MAGA is eliminating the woke leftist agenda! No more science. Only Trump.
Constant-Plant-9378 | 10 days ago
For decades, America has outsourced/offshored nearly all of its mass-manufacturing expertise to other countries (e.g., China).
As a result, the only unique competitive strength of the USA was innovation. We still designed the leading products that were built elsewhere.
But guess what, America has gone to war against education and the development of bright young minds. So we are losing the ability to innovate.
So, the United States will find itself lacking both the ability to make things as well as the ability to innovate.
We are just becoming Russia 2.0.
ditchdiggergirl | 9 days ago
>America has been about innovation and research and we are just…giving that up?
We aren’t giving up on that. We are deliberately shutting it down; switching off the lights in the lab and walking away.
Knerd5 | 10 days ago
You don’t want to give up one of our greatest assets so we can cut taxes for people who have more money than they need?
kck93 | 9 days ago
It’s shifting from data and discovery driven to money driven. The soulless world of accounting has no use for the enthusiasm of finding a new species, particle, medicine, technique, equation, etc.
It’s a mediocrity generator for science. Make it worth something NOW, or it won’t get funded.
Just don’t tell the statisticians there is someone more dry and stoic than they are. You’ll never be able to prove anything was discovered at all after they pick up the truth and stalk out the door with it! LOL! 🤣
deepasleep | 10 days ago
There is a book, “What Went Wrong: The Clash Between Islam and Modernity in the Middle East,” that analyzes how the Middle East lost its place as a global center of power as Europe moved from the Renaissance into modernity. The role of religion in politics and civil society and the inability to adapt rather than blame external forces for the disparity of outcomes very closely match what Christian Nationalists and Evangelicals are doing here in the US.
We need to come to grips with the fact that a LARGE portion of our population wants the Christian version of Sharia law, the WANT wealth inequality and top down government that aligns with their understanding of the world, and their morality is not based on any kind of objective analysis of impacts and outcomes it’s simply what their leaders tell them it is.
They are delusional and they are a threat to our future (not the least because over half of them want to see the end of the goddamned world).
Virtual-Alps-2888 | 10 days ago
I’m a little cautious of that book’s premise as that assumes that Europe and the Middle East were consistently distinct economic blocs, and for much of history it wasn’t. The Roman empire was not a European empire so much as a Mediterranean one, and that meant occupying much of southern Europe and the Middle East. Same with Byzantine. Middle Ages Europe and Middle East were deeply intertwined as centres of knowledge often intersected between Christian and Islamic lands, such as Roger III’s Italy, or ambiguous European-ness of the Ottomans.
slippery | 10 days ago
Republicans have fucked the US for at least a generation in almost every measurable dimension. I hope the US eventually recovers, but it won't happen in my lifetime. It's sad.
BalanceOrganic7735 | 10 days ago
Lysenkoism is a virus introduced into the USA by the anti-intellectual, Libertarian, anti-democracy cohort.
Just as Russia dealt with starvation for decades due to crop failure as a direct result of Lysenkoism, the USA will be crippled and weakened for decades (or longer) as a result of the anti-science attack from within.
BroughtBagLunchSmart | 10 days ago
Science disproves almost every single right wing belief so they told their hog voters that science is woke and gay. The dumbest people in the universe run the country now.
Busterlimes | 9 days ago
We will not see the US recover from Trump for generations, if ever. Honestly we will be lucky if the US doesnt experience Balkenization
RobustRhubarb | 10 days ago
The general public really doesn't understand or doesn't care how bad this situation is. As scientists we're in a lose-lose situation. We can sound the alarms but it doesn't reach the people it needs to. To them, the reality of the situation and content of what we say doesnt matter. We are just anti trump and mad that we lost our 'pet project' funding. This is decades of anti-intellictualism coming to full fruition and I honestly don't know how we can recover. I consider myself to be lucky as many of my colleagues had their careers essentially evaporate over the past year, and they are struggling to find jobs and might not be able to get back into research. But everyday dealing with the bullshit is getting tiring. Figuring out what to do with projects that got grants cut, rewriting maga fanfiction into project narratives and proposals to get funded, as well as being political scapegoats is exhausting.
After_Preference_885 | 10 days ago
Those assholes told their grandkids to all go into stem and then cut stem jobs. I hate them so much right now.
CliftonForce | 10 days ago
They also blame these same grandkids for racking up student loan debt after spending decades telling them that a college education was the key to making money.
After_Preference_885 | 10 days ago
They told me it was college or be homeless basically my whole life
DetroitLionsSBChamps | 10 days ago
Reminds me of the sopranos when AJ says maybe there’s no god and his parents freak out. And Meadow says “you guys want him to get education, this is what education does. You think it just means more money”
The right either doesn’t know or doesn’t care what science and stem are actually for. The rubes just know it means more money for the grandkids. The elites just want better workers to carry out their insane projects.
makemeking706 | 10 days ago
Have you seen new OMB rules being proposed? The worst is still to come.
The article doesn't even mention it. https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2026/05/29/2026-10817/regulation-for-federal-financial-assistance
RobustRhubarb | 10 days ago
I don't want to dox myself and give specifics, but as someone who is a peer reviewer for a major grant program this is already the case. This rule change would enshrine what is already happening now.
kck93 | 9 days ago
What nonsense. It’s using all kinds of unrelated programs available for the general population to justify restriction of grants going to major universities, etc under solid review by professionals.
enviroIQ | 10 days ago
Nailed it.
The rule of law is dead in this country.
We are a banana republic.
Socialmediaprosecution.com
kck93 | 9 days ago
You would think that the millions of dollars being used to remove deep water sensors so no one can ever use the technology again would wake someone up.
But no. It’s not good enough to simply not collect the data. We have to remove the hardware that’s is doing nothing from the ocean floor. 🙄
Virtual-Alps-2888 | 10 days ago
May I know what area of science you are in? No offense but I’m just wary of accounts that hide their post and comment history.
RobustRhubarb | 10 days ago
You should be. This is reddit. I'm a chemist and I work in biobased chemicals and materials. My account is hidden because I'm paranoid of getting doxed, and eventually I will nuke this account and start a fresh account with a new username. That's just the way I use social media.
Virtual-Alps-2888 | 10 days ago
Thanks I appreciate your reply! Academic here too, just not based in the US. Cheers!
RobustRhubarb | 10 days ago
No problem. By the way, you don't have to take my word for it. There are numerous reporters covering what science is like at federal institutions, universities, and as a whole in the US currently. This scientific American series is a good one since it tells some personal stories that give some of these numbers context- but what I described is widely reported and documented.
Virtual-Alps-2888 | 10 days ago
I believe you.
Cheap-Discussion-186 | 9 days ago
Make sure you tell us what kind of scientist you are so we know we should support you or not.
Virtual-Alps-2888 | 9 days ago
Economics related. Not exactly a science, but that’s debated in epistemological circles.
doubagilga | 9 days ago
$202 billion spent in 2025 for federal R&D spend. The highest ever. A $187 billion budget for 2026. A 6% cut.
Who rewrote what for funding? DEI anything having to be removed after being introduced a few years ago? ESG before that? And…so a less than ten year old practice had to stop?
Look it’s not the right decision fine. The sky isn’t falling.
RobustRhubarb | 9 days ago
Rewriting and writing new proposals to fit with the presidents policies. Getting funded is now less about fitting in with the mission of the funding agency and more about aligning to the administrations policy proposals. There are terms that are soft banned and result in applications getting flagged. It's not just DEI, but that has inadvertently stopped funding for things ranting from sickle cell research to biodiversity. This is what I've dealt with both writing and peer reviewing proposals, and it's well reported on by several outlets. Scientist have always had to go with the ebb and flow of funding, but what is happening now is fundamentally different from how it's worked throughout the scientifically landscape of the past 70 years. Frankly, I assume you have no idea what the current scientific landscape is like in the public sector if you aren't aware of this. You don't know what you're talking about and should read about what has been happening.
Sea_Dawgz | 10 days ago
“Last June the budget hawks in DOGE….”
Why does EVERYONE DO THIS?????
They didn’t save any money. It had nothing to do with people interested in saving money or better spending of money.
It was chaos for the sake of chaos to fuck shit up.
What does that have to do with “budget hawks?”
303uru | 10 days ago
Exactly, for example that dumbass Elon and Doge cut $15M a year in screwworm prevention measures, Trump just announced $1B to fight the outbreak. Every cut is resulting in massive newly incurred costs.
voxpopuli42 | 10 days ago
Pennywise and pound foolish
Knerd5 | 10 days ago
It’s always cheaper to pay for things through the front door than the back door.
makemeking706 | 10 days ago
Which we all knew would happen.
I can't even count how many times I had to explain how much money and time it would have costs to estimate the actual downstream costs of eliminating funding across the entire federal government.
Lust4Me | 10 days ago
But now that $1B will go to a newly created org with a PO Box and 5 staff with the same last name.
Arilluss | 10 days ago
I hate it. Always painting them in the light that they choose for themselves. Could be said for the entire Republican party.
Samanthacino | 10 days ago
Even the so-called “liberal media” exists as an apparatus to make Republicans seem reasonable
ohyeaher | 10 days ago
It wasn't just chaos. It was to shut down all the government agencies that were investigating Elon and his companies.
TraditionalLaw7763 | 9 days ago
👆🏼👆🏼☝🏼👆🏼☝🏼👆🏼☝🏼👆🏼☝🏼👆🏼☝🏼👆🏼☝🏼
AloneGunman | 10 days ago
I mean, self-proclaimed “budget hawks” are rarely acting in good faith. They just want to cut programs they don’t like.
TraditionalLaw7763 | 10 days ago
Our media has bent the knee.
Unique-Egg-461 | 10 days ago
Its WILD how much tone has shifted.
Biden was getting destroyed for having what was the globals best economy coming out of covid but their was somewhat high inflation which was, at least in my eyes, understandable.
Yet not a peep from media now that trump is derailing the economy and causing inflation to go up. Its like a "well everything is awful now, but what ya gonna do? ¯\(ツ)/¯"
Ancient-Living635 | 9 days ago
Agreed totally. Don’t you think it’s because of possible repercussions?
Goodk4t | 9 days ago
Everyone has bent the knee, because the brain dead US voters keep voting for Trump's regime. Why would anyone bother resisting anymore? Clearly they'll accomplish nothing except become targets for revenge.
MountainVeil | 9 days ago
> It was chaos for the sake of chaos to fuck shit up.
Don't be ridiculous! It was also to destroy federal oversight and regulations so that the ultra-rich can benefit.
Savings_Bed6172 | 9 days ago
It was their whole pitch after all. Outside of their blatent power grab and wealth transfer, fElon and his crew of methheads had to pick on some small fries to maintain the illusion that they were doing something. And why not pick on those nerd scientists that the trailer trash red hats already hate?
Methodical_Science | 10 days ago
The consequences of underfunding will amplify what is already happening. As a Stroke neurologist, several recent pivotal trials for stroke management have come out of China, and not the United States.
If not eventually taking the lead, China is at least establishing itself as a frontline innovator who can bring major developments to the rest of the world. That will pull talent away from the U.S.
RobustRhubarb | 10 days ago
Even from a purely pro US viewpoint it doesn't make sense. Science is something we actually have a competitive advantage at. We've been the scientific leaders of the world since post ww2 and we've attracted top talent from around the world to study in our country instead if their homes. We've been the defacto leaders of several international organizations and scientific committees and have exerted a lot of influence in that way. Now we've left a void for China or the EU to fill. It's a completely self inflicted self own. One of the real industry's that could've brought manufacturing jobs back was in biomanufacturing and biotech. Supply chains and infrastructure for manufacturing new medicines, new consumer products, and ither new bioproducts will likely build out in China over the next decade. It's already started, but this basically cements us as losers in this space.
Delicious-Bat2373 | 10 days ago
Yes. Science transcends borders and those in the scientific community are still cooperating with international partners. Advancements will continue to happen here, albeit at a much slower pace. Sadly capitalism and profits will decimate our ability to wage wars of discovery for years to come. We're entering an age of stupidification. Too much reliance on AI and computers for all the wrong things.
Delicious-Bat2373 | 10 days ago
I believe China saw this coming 10 years ago and has been positioning itself to capture talent and global influence since, if not earlier.
Samanthacino | 10 days ago
China always plays the long game. They’re content to let their opponents blow their own heads off.
Delicious-Bat2373 | 10 days ago
Yep. Obvious statements often surprise me, so when China said "we've been around for thousands of years and will survive..." lol. I knew they are hardly concerned with us.
Sad that after 250 years this country still acts like a bunch of infant mini-nations that can't seem to grasp, lifting up your neighbors and everyone brings national prosperity to all.
[OP] OrangeJr36 | 10 days ago
This article has two alternate titles:
For the web version
>America’s compact between science and politics is broken
For the print version
>State of American Science
Both have "U.S. science is in chaos" as the main alt title.
Regardless, both versions paint how dire the situation in US science has become in just a year in a half under an aggressively anti-science administration
makemeking706 | 10 days ago
They didn't even mention what is on the horizon that has scientists really scrambling.
https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2026/05/29/2026-10817/regulation-for-federal-financial-assistance
Drysui | 10 days ago
Anyone who is working in anything science adjacent knows it's irreversible damage that's being done. We left the US, not because of Trump, but aren't going to ever come back because of him and the Americans who supported him by the tens of millions. So now you have the kids of two highly educated STEM parents growing up in Europe and guess where they'll be studying and then working?
MountainVeil | 9 days ago
Ya love to see it. I have similar feelings about the people of my homeland (US). Maybe your kids will have a libertarian rebel phase and go back to the US though.
supercyberlurker | 10 days ago
Is it chaos? Chaos seems like something unintentional, unordered.
This is all by design. There's a plan behind it being executed with a letter and a year name.
Broken, sabotaged, kneecapped.. that's not the same as chaos.
Itburns12345 | 10 days ago
Bad news for america
Good for china and europe
FourScoreAndSept | 10 days ago
Also Iran, they’ll soon have $300B of American dollars to (re)build their university R&D ecosystem.
/s (sort of)
Basicly-Inevitable | 10 days ago
That's the entire point.
WalterWoodiaz | 10 days ago
Europe? Who has also had defunded science for decades?
Itburns12345 | 10 days ago
Not on the outright agressive fashion the trump regime is doing
FourScoreAndSept | 10 days ago
Opportunity for Europe, and they’re correctly already knocking
WalterWoodiaz | 10 days ago
Barely lmao, their funding is not going up in any reasonable capacity.
Better_Goose_431 | 10 days ago
Those programs are hiring a very small handful of scientists. When the DOGE stuff started, Denmark made an announcement about hiring American scientists, then when you looked into it, they were hiring ~100-200 people. Other countries launched recruiting programs as well, but the numbers weren’t much higher. American universities produced around 58,000 PhDs in 2024. These increases are a drop in the bucket relatively to the American research sector
Prestigious_Sir2079 | 10 days ago
As much as I loathe this admin and what they are doing to research, I do have to say that there are too many PhDs being generated. It has been a problem for over a decade, perhaps longer. Schools push out barely trained PhDs to feed the grist mill of postdoc labor. I spend too much time retraining them as postdocs and then they can't find positions resulting in them taking lab tech jobs that have traditionally been held by people with lesser degrees. It's an arms race of initials after names to get jobs. Almost all of this is caused by not enough funding for research. Universities can't keep PhD students long enough for proper training since the funds to carry them are limited. Labs need postdocs for cheaper labor because of the lack of funds for permanent positions. There is a glut of underutilized undertrained PhDs because they were sold a line about STEM but not supported by society.
ConflagWex | 10 days ago
It doesn't matter if a bomb going off was intentional or not, the destruction afterwards is still chaos.
Xoxitl | 9 days ago
Yes, similar to the problems in China with the Great Leap Forward, Stalin and the holodomor, Vietnam after the communists won, other famines where there were “distribution problems” with plenty of food available where governments used the excuse of “chaos or bad management” to destroy systems that keep society running so that people are more worried about survival than politics.
After WWII the US was busy making itself Great by spending tons of money on education from elementary through phd and starting social support programs like free lunch in schools and expanding global political influence with programs like usaid.
Now the US government is on a speed run to demolish all the pipelines that helped form, educate and support the people that made it great.
It’s gotta be purposeful and why aren’t the people in positions of power like senators trying to stop this dismantling.
Arilluss | 10 days ago
Sure but if you say that "chaos" has "erupted" due to "DOGE budget hawks" it makes it seem as if by constraining the budget, scientists have been inadvertently flummoxed. Now we're picturing Doc Brown instead of wealthy oligarchs
Unique-Egg-461 | 10 days ago
almost like the admin is specifically acting against America's best interests
modechsn | 10 days ago
They are taking food out of kids mouths, do you think they will respect something as abstract as science? They don’t understand it and don’t seem to care about anything that won’t make them richer in the short term.
GrandMasterPuba | 10 days ago
There is a YouTube video by astrophysicist Angela Collier that goes into detail on the destruction of US science and the "Genesis Mission" program that has been instituted.
The long and short of it is that the entire public institution of science has been dismantled and the remains have been auctioned off to private companies through mandatory "industry partners" for all grants who own all IP and discoveries acquired through any subsequent research and development.
dubiouscoffee | 10 days ago
Even Reagan gave some degree of a shit about science - Superconducting Supercollider for example. The current crop of republicans are just dumb.
Am_Snek_AMA | 10 days ago
Dumb or spineless. I am not sure which is worse.
TikiTDO | 10 days ago
Oh, who needs lots of high paying jobs, worldwide prestige, having the foundation for knowledge and skills that will carry the country into the next century, or the scientific discoveries that would secure the future of the nation? Scientists can just learn Chinese, and have you seen the prices on mega yachts these days. This way some government official will be able to afford the gold trim, and isn't that what's truly important in this world?
YeetCompleet | 10 days ago
> Last June the budget hawks in the Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE) pushed NASA into offering a broad package of buyouts, paid leave and early retirement. Over the next few weeks nearly 4,000 NASA employees—about a fifth of the workforce—took the deal.
Entirely self inflicted
kc3x | 10 days ago
I dont think people understand, How much Money is about/IS being Funneled into Red States. Look at Alabama(has jumped allot in education stats where they put all this new funding) not saying its a bad but Blue states they are looking to make a funding desert so kids will choose States with Funding.
BourbonSupreme | 9 days ago
This has little to do with current politics though. Huntsville's Research Park began in the 1960s.
Huntsville has NASA and about 300 other government contractors. It's one of the most educated cities in the US. There are a lot of rocket scientists and aerospace engineers there.
You can fact check all of that. But the point is that you can't just redirect the funding to a Blue state and federal money isn't being 'funneled' to Alabama
Birmingham became a medical hub. Lots of money, lots of research. Med school and hospital that draws people from all over the world.
The rest of Alabama may be rural and inbred. Got to be honest though, some cities have rightfully earned federal funding
Moneyshot_ITF | 10 days ago
Americans pay more taxes with less to show for it. USA universities are in huge huge trouble and the only thing Congress has focused on is College Football.
Ok_Programmer_4449 | 9 days ago
And making sure everyone needs a chromosome test to use the bathroom.
pantsmeplz | 10 days ago
Hanging with some friends recently who have a friend in CA that's a high level science professor at one of the UC programs. His research has been kneecapped and he's decided to retire to another country asap. This professor told our friends he's hearing a lot of science professors are pondering their future in America.
Ultra_HNWI | 10 days ago
It's the non partisan fact finding truth seeking. Try talking to a scientist about this and they are beyond unreasonable, heads of solid granite!
The scene could have a better vibe if scientists weren't so high strung.
/s
Effective-Ebb-2805 | 9 days ago
Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that the federal government is actively sabotaging it at every turn? Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that the current administration has fostered and benefited from stoking people's distrust of science and rewarded them emotionally for taking pride in their ignorance?
Viva_La_Revolucion- | 9 days ago
No worries some invisible man in the sky will save you Americans /s
Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah
elextric_lizard | 9 days ago
If anyone can recommend a country that pays it's PHD and master's STEM and science students a liveable wage, and respects as well as gives science a chance, i'd love to know. I'm a queer and trans STEM major in the US looking to get out and move to another country or study in another country. ❤️🏳️⚧️