The article highlights an actual issue. It sure feels like dotcom boom again (kids don't remember)... Everything is buzzing and demanding to be on the edge. Everything is developing except the real world us.
I read it (even the snobby bits bragging about drinking orange wine).
Are these people for real, or is silicon valley in some double bubble of middle class techno elitist hell of their own making?
Nobody comes out well in that article, the husbands, the wives, the partners, the social circles.
I am British, I use AI, I love it, but I switch off and talk about tidying up the garden or doing stuff with my wife. Yes AI is flavour of the last few years but it hasn't chopped up my carrots for me, or sprayed weed killer on my monoblock driveway.
Going to just leave this whole story with a pinch of salt.
Yeah I think AI is this amazing world changing technology, and have no problems going days without using it. Some people seem consumed by it in a way I don't understand.
It was Karl Marx who said that technology pretty much determines our culture and society. I largely agree, so I find it strange and un-relatable when people say their lives have not changed as much after AI. AI will affect almost every aspect of your life and society even if you choose to not take part in it.
Good old historical materialism. I don't think even staunch libertarians can argue with it - it's a pretty good mental model to understand societal/political change. After all, we have a tendency to name periods after their defining technology (stone, bronze, ..., steam, ..., information), and the inflection points tend to be pretty dramatic.
I've realized over time that I don't live the most...focused, goal-oriented life; a lot of what I decide to do is constrained by what I can or cannot do. If I don't have the money, I don't do the thing. If I do and someone asks, or I'm feeling a little impulsive, I will.
In the digital world, there was a ton of stuff I was interested in doing but was unable to accomplish, either because I didn't have the technical knowledge or the time to do it.
AI makes you feel like anything is possible! A lot of people aren't used to the mental model of "having a team of people who can do stuff for you", and there's definitely a way we can get lost in that.
I'm thankful I have a wife that drags me out of my office enough that I think I've reasonably kept in touch with reality, ha.
> I've realized over time that I don't live the most...focused, goal-oriented life; a lot of what I decide to do is constrained by what I can or cannot do.
The human experience. We all share it, many of us spend a lot of time ignoring it or pretending we can overcome it. There are many ways to describe it, and I'm happy for you that you can see it.
I can understand that some people feel this way, but it still shocks me how common this feeling is.
I feel the complete opposite. I used to spend hours reading and figuring things out on my computer, but since AI I can't wait to log off and get back to the real world.
I’m creating so much stuff. Music, games, candles, laser-cut jigsaw puzzles, and then a whole platform of test and CNC infra underneath it all.
If I had a thousand years I don’t think I’d finish everything I want to build.
But I kind of miss the gym, the outdoors, just… reading. It’s just so hard to disconnect when there is always some agent/project just waiting for the next bit of guidance.
Jealous of what? Everything you mentioned is within your power and trivial to achieve. If you miss going to the gym, the outdoors, reading, then go do those things! Go do any of them right now. If you can be on HN, you can pick up a book or go take a walk outside.
I’m sorry to say, and I say this without any judgement and as someone who can relate, but you’re describing yourself as an addict. You don’t have to pursue all those projects. Most to all of them don’t matter for anything except getting you your temporary “fix”. I understand it feels hard to disconnect, but that’s a purely psychological barrier, the physical action (not doing something) is tremendously simple.
Try to remember that the point of music is to listen/perform it, the point of games is to play them, the point of CNC is to build things with it that you enjoy using.
Try to tie everything back to the things you, at the root, enjoy, and to build in time for them, not just the things that enable them.
I was thinking about yesterday - and I can't find it now - a comment or an article about how dangerous LLMs are to folks with ADHD tendencies because it just supercharges the "oh I made this!" receptors and is really hard to break out of. It's like playing Minecraft or something on steroids.
It depends entirely on how OP is taking it. They said they “realised” their life is like that, not that they accepted it. It’s at best ambiguous if they see that lack of focus and goals as a positive or negative. From the rest of their comment it seems to me (and of course I could be misreading) they feel it as a negative and are “filling the void” by engaging furiously with AI, to the point (by their own admission) they only think they’ve “reasonably kept in touch with reality”.
Doesn‘t seem to me that someone who feels freed by a lack of goals and focus would routinely engage in activities which shy away from interacting with reality. The opposite is true, that’s the definition of escapism.
Three fourths of that reply wasn’t even about you, it was a lament at the state of the world. The last fourth was directed at you but it was in no way meant to be insulting. On the contrary, it was a call to action, and when one is too deep out of it (which you suggested you might be), more forceful words are necessary.
I do apologise if my choice of words made you feel bad, as that was not my intention, but I stand by the sentiment. Tellingly, I’m not seeing you refute that your relationship with AI is harming your relationship with reality. I can only go from your words, and of course there’s always the possibility (which I have readily admitted) that I have misinterpreted them.
Your words have also suggested to me that you like your wife and that she cares about you, so I’ll say it again: If you’re in your office (presumably at home) and your wife is in the other room, get off your computer, be it HN or AI, and go hug her. You both deserve to be loved and there’s nothing on your screen more important than that.
It’s called prioritisation. You will never have time for everything and that’s a good thing. The goal of a technological society should be to improve the lives of its citizens so they all have the opportunity to pursue their interests, which might in turn enhance the lives of others too. Instead, we’re falling off the cliff in the opposite direction, everyone wanting to do everything on their own, with complete disregard for how it affects others. It’s me me me, we lock ourselves down in our rooms trying to achieve individual success, fame, admiration. What that has gotten us is a culture of child billionaires who think they deserve to be on top of the world stomping on everyone else, while wannabe influencers drool and promote that behaviour in the misguided hope of one day doing the stomping. It’s a bacchanal of inhumanity. We’re tripping so hard we’ve forgotten what real life is, and the hangover will be brutal and unforgiving. I only weep for those who have tried to do better, who will also suffer the consequences.
Get the fuck off your computer and go do something with your wife. I promise you whatever you’re doing with AI is worthless in comparison. If you truly are grateful, prove it by dragging yourself out of the office unprompted and go do something with and for her. She’s your wife, not your caretaker, go be together.
Hey, that guy should ask Claude about the future developments of his relationship given how disconnected he is. And then his wife will be able to shout that awful and cold "Wow, looook at that!"
Special note to anyone thinking alterity is useless in the AI era.
Because goal is to trigger emotional/tribal response from both sides and thus better "engagement" all while using proven and well established tropes like "he doesnt want to do what she wants", "toddler", "lazy bum vs overworked" etc
The gender angle is simply a consequence of the frame of reference of the author, a woman. She notes this herself:
> There’s a strange and under-discussed side effect of the AI boom: what it’s doing to family dynamics. By which I mean: how it’s potentially destroying family dynamics. I’m sure this applies to all kinds of families, gay or straight, rich or poor, with any AI-pilled members. The technology is coming, has come, for us all. But for the purposes of this story, I mostly spoke to white-collar heteros in the Bay Area, because that’s where a certain psychological crisis seems most acute.
Wifes of people working on AI and living in the epicenter of AI feel like AI in a country where a lot of people define their life based on how successful are at work feel like AI is talk is intruding in their private lives?
Ironically it feels like an article that mentions AI to ride the AI-wave that it is the source of the bad things it talks about...
This is a sub-variant of "phone addiction", isn't it. Or maybe just "guy is really, really into hobby to obsessional levels, to the detriment of the rest of his life". A pattern that pre-dates computers.
I didn't read everything but the article didn't seem to give any details about what's special about AI vs any other obsession anyone might have. If anything, I think it applies more to things like videogames or social networks, I feel they're more addictive and demanding of your time.
The major difference the article presents is the scale of it (in the Bay Area). It is one thing if it is just one or two households in your social circle, it's another if it's half or so.
The article actually states that many of these "AI-pilled" men are basically serial grifter-founder-losers who've latched onto AI as their next get rich scheme.
> this is their last chance. They’ve tried everything else, these men, from writing screenplays to investing in crypto. It’s AI or bust
Maybe those other things are more demanding on the extreme end but they’re not as pervasive at an already harmful level.
Think of two diseases. One completely destroys your body and the other “just” cripples you. But the former spreads slowly and so far only affects one in a thousand people, while the latter is spreading like wild fire and is affecting one in three. You can see how the latter, even if less harmful on an individual level, is more harmful on a societal scale.
I work remotely and use the 5-hour limits as a way to avoid AI addiction, seeing them as the world giving a sign to touch grass, be with the wife and so on. This way, they feel more of a blessing than a curse.
> I should also say I didn’t bother speaking to any of the actual husbands for this story. I’m sick of hearing from the men of AI.
That's quite a line after half a page of inferring said men's inner workings and motivations from what their wives and their wives' therapists say about them (quite cynically i might add)
> A tiktok meme has been making the rounds recently: young women at their laptops or doing their makeup, captioned something like, “Working so hard so my man can work on his AI startup that loses $30K a month.” The comments section stands in solidarity: “I’m ded.” “Yas queen.” “Just so he can have ‘founder’ in his bio.” I tried to reach out to some of these women. None bit.
That might be because this person doesn't even exist, or at least it's not the people making these tiktok memes
Most if not all of this just reads like generic "SF tech worker riding the hype of current technology XYZ", slotted into the social media mainstream "AI ruins everything"-sentiment. Not sure what the point of this is.
> The responses are generally uninspiring.
How ironic. Writing this entire article and harping on about how the AI Boom is "doing to family dynamics" and how it's "potentially destroying families" via fathers, with barely one paragraph even remotely touching the subject of people getting emotional advice or attachment from chatbots (see r/myboyfriendisai) just comes off as misandrist to me.
Edit: I was curious who the author was, so i clicked around her socials a bit. among the publications she says she worked at, there is ~one piece of media she published in the last 8 years (this one), and the podcast/studio she cofounded/hosts averages ~30 youtube views per episode.
> And then, the men. Neither of my friends’ husbands actually makes money from AI. Not yet.
Yup, this is definitely the latest gold rush. And there will be a lot of losers and some winners, just like every other time.
And anyone who feels the floor being taken out from under them will feel the pressure to join the gold rush, just like every other time.
And it's going to put unnatural pressures on relationships and families, and even destroy a lot of them, just like every other time.
And people will feel resentful and alone and confused, and say that things shouldn't be this way - it's not fair the way things are and where they're going. Just like every other time.
My sympathies go with those who are suffering under this, but when forces beyond your control are threatening your livelihood, you do what you must and hope for the best.
And when there is a gold rush going on, be the one selling the shovels.
It’s equally sad and predictable that this article got flagged. Piece of advice: refusing to look at our own problems does not make them go away. If you hope to ever get better, you have to first recognise the issue then be willing to admit your faults. Only then can we proceed to better ourselves.
The number of recent articles that were flagged or artificially pulled down is the last straw for me. Not that this was the best piece I've ever read (far from it), but... WTF? I mean this wasn't even political.
I guess it goes against the Y Combinator origin of Hacker News to be negative towards AI when so much of the current bubble / hyper is banking on the continued success story of AI? I was surprised by the flagging as well.
The last submission I thought was informative and also well-executed technically was about wealth inequality in the US (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50270764). That one wasn't flagged but was artificially demoted to not appear on the front page, despite being at the top of /active.
It's very disappointing as HN doesn't feel organic anymore to me. In my naive worldview, I perceived it as a place where cool (& not so cool) projects where shared, and where somebody working in the industry could also get their tech news to stay up to date. But increasingly it seems to me that any content that is critical of SV venture capitalism and its fruits will be actively suppressed, and to me that's just not acceptable in a publication.
A man has a bady, a wife, a job and a few hobbies.
A ideally a responsible guy (whey the baby is born) confirms with himself that he will sacrifice something for some time.
Him not being able to may be a problem, but this has nothing to do with AI. Could have been a bottle, an instrument or a "Halo night with friends"
That not "sad wives of AI". It's "say wives of dudes who can't really understand or accept their role yet". And the only (and best) thing a woman can do is to have a serious talk.
I think the article is drawing a distinction between AI and the other things you mention. But, sure, if someone were dedicating the same amount of time and effort to an instrument, and there seemed to be some kind of pattern whereby many people were doing the same, it could be comparable.
I think 90% of this article is not actually about AI at all, but about how obsessive workaholic behavior can ruin relationships. The article itself notes how AI is just the latest bubble or hype in a long line of previous ones. The only actual relevance of AI is that some of the "sad wives of AI" are using AI to rubberduck how bad their situation is, which only receives validation, because of AI sycophancy, leading to situations like cheating on the marriage as an escape from the bad situation (which itself makes the situation worse, not better).
> "Neither of my friends’ husbands actually makes money from AI."
That's a pain point many will recognize, and it will probably never go away. Spousal neglect can become a problem. But at the same time wives don't have some innate ability to detect a bubble. They're also critical of their husbands for being driven enough to fight for a better life for the whole family.
Yesterday morning I was thinking about building a god tier language which will break the internet. I spent hours thinking and designing it, only to end up realising that something which takes huge teams years to build cannot be done alone. Although I learnt many new things, but the inspiration was gone with the realisation. How much better it would have been if I had spent that time with friends and enjoyed the real world. My social life is trash, and maybe spending hours on my laptop is the reason behind it.
The core conflict underlying these households seems to me to be that the couple has agreed explicitly, implicitly, or unknowingly automatically that the man should focus on their career and the woman's first priority should be the relationships in the family and the household. If this were not the case then these women should be able to negotiate that the male partner invest less in their career and more at home, and the risk associated with that should fall under the responsibility of the female partner (and that might mean that the female partner invests more into being the breadwinner of the household).
Anonasty | 5 hours ago
wannabe44 | 5 hours ago
tomaytotomato | 4 hours ago
tomaytotomato | 5 hours ago
Are these people for real, or is silicon valley in some double bubble of middle class techno elitist hell of their own making?
Nobody comes out well in that article, the husbands, the wives, the partners, the social circles.
I am British, I use AI, I love it, but I switch off and talk about tidying up the garden or doing stuff with my wife. Yes AI is flavour of the last few years but it hasn't chopped up my carrots for me, or sprayed weed killer on my monoblock driveway.
Going to just leave this whole story with a pinch of salt.
quixoticelixer- | 4 hours ago
simianwords | 4 hours ago
nikitau | 4 hours ago
ablation | 4 hours ago
kondu | 4 hours ago
Brendinooo | 4 hours ago
I've realized over time that I don't live the most...focused, goal-oriented life; a lot of what I decide to do is constrained by what I can or cannot do. If I don't have the money, I don't do the thing. If I do and someone asks, or I'm feeling a little impulsive, I will.
In the digital world, there was a ton of stuff I was interested in doing but was unable to accomplish, either because I didn't have the technical knowledge or the time to do it.
AI makes you feel like anything is possible! A lot of people aren't used to the mental model of "having a team of people who can do stuff for you", and there's definitely a way we can get lost in that.
I'm thankful I have a wife that drags me out of my office enough that I think I've reasonably kept in touch with reality, ha.
mathgeek | 4 hours ago
The human experience. We all share it, many of us spend a lot of time ignoring it or pretending we can overcome it. There are many ways to describe it, and I'm happy for you that you can see it.
kypro | 4 hours ago
I can understand that some people feel this way, but it still shocks me how common this feeling is.
I feel the complete opposite. I used to spend hours reading and figuring things out on my computer, but since AI I can't wait to log off and get back to the real world.
brookst | 3 hours ago
I’m creating so much stuff. Music, games, candles, laser-cut jigsaw puzzles, and then a whole platform of test and CNC infra underneath it all.
If I had a thousand years I don’t think I’d finish everything I want to build.
But I kind of miss the gym, the outdoors, just… reading. It’s just so hard to disconnect when there is always some agent/project just waiting for the next bit of guidance.
latexr | 3 hours ago
I’m sorry to say, and I say this without any judgement and as someone who can relate, but you’re describing yourself as an addict. You don’t have to pursue all those projects. Most to all of them don’t matter for anything except getting you your temporary “fix”. I understand it feels hard to disconnect, but that’s a purely psychological barrier, the physical action (not doing something) is tremendously simple.
AndrewDucker | 2 hours ago
Try to tie everything back to the things you, at the root, enjoy, and to build in time for them, not just the things that enable them.
soupfordummies | 13 minutes ago
maxehmookau | 4 hours ago
Freeing as hell though, isn't it? I'm happy for you.
latexr | an hour ago
Doesn‘t seem to me that someone who feels freed by a lack of goals and focus would routinely engage in activities which shy away from interacting with reality. The opposite is true, that’s the definition of escapism.
Brendinooo | 55 minutes ago
latexr | 27 minutes ago
I do apologise if my choice of words made you feel bad, as that was not my intention, but I stand by the sentiment. Tellingly, I’m not seeing you refute that your relationship with AI is harming your relationship with reality. I can only go from your words, and of course there’s always the possibility (which I have readily admitted) that I have misinterpreted them.
Your words have also suggested to me that you like your wife and that she cares about you, so I’ll say it again: If you’re in your office (presumably at home) and your wife is in the other room, get off your computer, be it HN or AI, and go hug her. You both deserve to be loved and there’s nothing on your screen more important than that.
latexr | 4 hours ago
Get the fuck off your computer and go do something with your wife. I promise you whatever you’re doing with AI is worthless in comparison. If you truly are grateful, prove it by dragging yourself out of the office unprompted and go do something with and for her. She’s your wife, not your caretaker, go be together.
VCFundedGenYer | 2 hours ago
Bengalilol | 4 hours ago
Special note to anyone thinking alterity is useless in the AI era.
Hendrikto | 4 hours ago
> Either way, the men go in and the women want out.
Why make this about gender?
pjc50 | 4 hours ago
nikitau | 4 hours ago
Jtarii | 4 hours ago
Because that is the entire point of the article?
pxtail | 4 hours ago
Because goal is to trigger emotional/tribal response from both sides and thus better "engagement" all while using proven and well established tropes like "he doesnt want to do what she wants", "toddler", "lazy bum vs overworked" etc
xolox | 3 hours ago
> There’s a strange and under-discussed side effect of the AI boom: what it’s doing to family dynamics. By which I mean: how it’s potentially destroying family dynamics. I’m sure this applies to all kinds of families, gay or straight, rich or poor, with any AI-pilled members. The technology is coming, has come, for us all. But for the purposes of this story, I mostly spoke to white-collar heteros in the Bay Area, because that’s where a certain psychological crisis seems most acute.
marcyb5st | 4 hours ago
Ironically it feels like an article that mentions AI to ride the AI-wave that it is the source of the bad things it talks about...
pjc50 | 4 hours ago
jareklupinski | 3 hours ago
something about how tarpit skeletons are mostly male :P
throwthrowuknow | 4 hours ago
lz400 | 4 hours ago
jhanschoo | 4 hours ago
motionlessveloc | 4 hours ago
> this is their last chance. They’ve tried everything else, these men, from writing screenplays to investing in crypto. It’s AI or bust
wannabe44 | 3 hours ago
latexr | 3 hours ago
Think of two diseases. One completely destroys your body and the other “just” cripples you. But the former spreads slowly and so far only affects one in a thousand people, while the latter is spreading like wild fire and is affecting one in three. You can see how the latter, even if less harmful on an individual level, is more harmful on a societal scale.
phillennium | 4 hours ago
fxwin | 4 hours ago
> I should also say I didn’t bother speaking to any of the actual husbands for this story. I’m sick of hearing from the men of AI.
That's quite a line after half a page of inferring said men's inner workings and motivations from what their wives and their wives' therapists say about them (quite cynically i might add)
> A tiktok meme has been making the rounds recently: young women at their laptops or doing their makeup, captioned something like, “Working so hard so my man can work on his AI startup that loses $30K a month.” The comments section stands in solidarity: “I’m ded.” “Yas queen.” “Just so he can have ‘founder’ in his bio.” I tried to reach out to some of these women. None bit.
That might be because this person doesn't even exist, or at least it's not the people making these tiktok memes
Most if not all of this just reads like generic "SF tech worker riding the hype of current technology XYZ", slotted into the social media mainstream "AI ruins everything"-sentiment. Not sure what the point of this is.
> The responses are generally uninspiring.
How ironic. Writing this entire article and harping on about how the AI Boom is "doing to family dynamics" and how it's "potentially destroying families" via fathers, with barely one paragraph even remotely touching the subject of people getting emotional advice or attachment from chatbots (see r/myboyfriendisai) just comes off as misandrist to me.
Edit: I was curious who the author was, so i clicked around her socials a bit. among the publications she says she worked at, there is ~one piece of media she published in the last 8 years (this one), and the podcast/studio she cofounded/hosts averages ~30 youtube views per episode.
> And then, the men. Neither of my friends’ husbands actually makes money from AI. Not yet.
But yes. "The men".
kstenerud | 4 hours ago
And anyone who feels the floor being taken out from under them will feel the pressure to join the gold rush, just like every other time.
And it's going to put unnatural pressures on relationships and families, and even destroy a lot of them, just like every other time.
And people will feel resentful and alone and confused, and say that things shouldn't be this way - it's not fair the way things are and where they're going. Just like every other time.
My sympathies go with those who are suffering under this, but when forces beyond your control are threatening your livelihood, you do what you must and hope for the best.
And when there is a gold rush going on, be the one selling the shovels.
mcphage | 2 hours ago
Generally that works, but in this AI boom, everybody is trying to sell shovels, and there isn’t that much gold coming out.
latexr | 4 hours ago
alex_suzuki | 3 hours ago
xolox | 3 hours ago
alex_suzuki | 3 hours ago
It's very disappointing as HN doesn't feel organic anymore to me. In my naive worldview, I perceived it as a place where cool (& not so cool) projects where shared, and where somebody working in the industry could also get their tech news to stay up to date. But increasingly it seems to me that any content that is critical of SV venture capitalism and its fruits will be actively suppressed, and to me that's just not acceptable in a publication.
pjc50 | 2 hours ago
konart | 3 hours ago
A man has a bady, a wife, a job and a few hobbies.
A ideally a responsible guy (whey the baby is born) confirms with himself that he will sacrifice something for some time.
Him not being able to may be a problem, but this has nothing to do with AI. Could have been a bottle, an instrument or a "Halo night with friends"
That not "sad wives of AI". It's "say wives of dudes who can't really understand or accept their role yet". And the only (and best) thing a woman can do is to have a serious talk.
Coming from a father of a 4 y.o.
oneeyedpigeon | 3 hours ago
xolox | 3 hours ago
pmdr | 3 hours ago
That's a pain point many will recognize, and it will probably never go away. Spousal neglect can become a problem. But at the same time wives don't have some innate ability to detect a bubble. They're also critical of their husbands for being driven enough to fight for a better life for the whole family.
geekgod382 | 3 hours ago
jhanschoo | 3 hours ago