> I must admit I never tested this with Opus 5.5, so I'm not sure whether this was possible before Fable 5.2 rolled around.
Since somewhere around Opus 4+ it's been really good enough to do these things, but 4.6 was the most pivotal version since a 1 million token context window can allow a model to fit so much "in its head" basically.
This is both cute but also a bit sad in terms of game stylization, I guess these generic AI designs could become so normal to the youth that in the next 10-20 years it just appears everywhere
that kind of stuff happened routinely in the 70s-90s in mecha anime franchises that were designed/drawn/animated/produced by large teams of adults..
Mobile Suit Gundam and Evangelion are both notorious for this. Is Eva-01 40m or 100m tall? If you trust the technical literature then you'd be forced to deduce that the tanks in some of the scenes are squirrel-sized -- and these decisions and scenes are produced by committees.
- punch and kick don't seem to have differences in effect, just animation
- bosses don't have obvious gimmicks to beat them
But the main take-away for me is that this takes me back to computing in my youth, where you could dream up a project and bash it out in a few days. It wouldn't be polished, it wouldn't be perfect, but it would be yours. It would do what you wanted. Computing was ours, it didn't yet belong to big corporations controlling what we could do and how we could do it.
Projects like this give me hope that a new generation will experience that. Aiden won't ever forget this game, even if it's nothing special to you or me. Aiden won't ever forget that feeling of imagining a change, and having it happen. The price for it would've been somewhere around $300-$500, so not exactly broadly accessible - making AI efficient enough to run cheaply should be the main goal of humanity, but we're letting computing get locked up by a few rich sociopaths once again.
Related: I don't see how any kid is going to have the motivation and patience to learn how to program a game like this from scratch now when you can just conjure it up with an LLM.
Why would I sit through years of education? The number of competent programmers is going to drop significantly, but also, people are not going to learn the patience and commitment necessary to do hard things, which is part of learning to program.
That was already happening before AI, with in-house game engines dying off and all converging on the same quasi-realistic style and often the exact same assets.
Games used to have very unique, noticeable styles that you could instantly place from a screenshot. Now everything just looks like Unreal, Unity, or generic 2D.
Hopefully AI might actually make it easier to be more ambitious with unique art styles, should the developer choose to do so.
I'm kind of hoping that the youth will recognize that stuff that can be made with AI is just nothing special anymore, and find something that is (or still is) special. I don't know what that is, maybe something that AI can't do on a fundamental level (maybe something physical?).
(Of course, at this point it might be necessary to point out that "the youth" is a diverse bunch, and some will be like this and others like that.)
don't really think there will be anything - this is an entity that can learn anything (even physical things) faster than any human or the collective of humanity for that matter.
I've found analog photography to be a rewarding hobby, and although an LLM can help me refresh my memory, the overall experience is certainly not something that an LLM can replace.
We also connect to people through art and play. So if we automate those things, then I guess we'll spend the rest of our lives living unsatisfying experiences.
If you "automate human interaction and connection" you simply no longer have those things. Which, from the top down, seems to be a goal, to isolate people from one another, make them 100% disposable cogs. As this chick in the streets of Paris said in some YT short when asked about "AI", fuck that, humans want to be together, you can't beat that. And why would we even want to... it's easier, and more sensible, for a person to seek help or get over themselves, than for them to drain all humanity out of the rest of humanity just so they themselves can blend in without having to change. Fix the root problems, rather than spending such huge amounts of resources and intellectual integrity for workarounds that, at the end of the day, are kind of sad and cringe.
This style reminds me of those mobile game ads with helpless characters that need YOUR help not to freeze or something. Probably the exaggerated facial expressions.
You can change the stylization with LLMs. I think what we're seeing is simply any barriers to code/design/art/music/etc completely going away.
But those barriers going away now means that the starting point is much closer to where the finish line used to be. Like a few years ago this would have been an upper tier beat-em-up. I think we're still early enough in the window that I'd still call this upper tier, but the reality is that it's also now something that an uncle can vibe code for his nephew over a weekend.
In general I think this is going to be very good for everybody, but it's going to completely destroy the software as a problem-solving industry, and make the software as entertainment industry much more competitive.
Barriers going away means you get a lot more at the bottom and middle of the pack, but a game is more than the sum of its parts, and as long as LLMs do what you tell them, you need to have real talent to make good games.
Was this game fun for you? For me it certainly was, and ultimately that's all that matters to me. And that's why I said I'd classify it as a top-tier game because IMO most games that get released, slop and 'professional' alike, simply aren't fun. Even on these forums there's plenty of people posting thinly veiled hopes of going viral along the lines of 'I spent 5 years to fail with my game' when as lovingly hand-crafted as the games may have been - they invariably just weren't any fun to play!
In any case, it being "extremely far" from the top would just imply I should be in endless bliss with the current state of things since if I find this game quite fun then higher tier beat-em-ups would be just the most incredible thing I've ever played in my life. That has certainly not been my experience.
I found it stiff and weird. The "art" is screaming Saturday morning cartoons which I successfully evaded since even as a kid. TMNT aren't nostalgic for me because by that time I was like 12 and didn't even think to interact with that baby stuff, and I wouldn't have dreamed it would be put on the test by adults later. And art and charm is all that could have saved this, because as a game, if you replaced the art with wireframe hitboxes, it's just nothing.
Double Dragon I have fond memories of, and this is why this one bored me after 30 seconds, because it's so meh compared to even the worst game of that type of that era that I played.
I’m going to go out on a limb and predict the opposite.
I think “the youth” are going to grow up with a Cambrian explosion of styles, mashups, callbacks, revivals, etc.
Right now a vibecoded game just uses the generic style. But you could easily imagine the kid saying to Claude “rebuild this game but in the style of that old show [Samurai Jack | Ren and Stimpy | … ]. We are so early in the tech curve, market penetration is still very low, and the “creator-years” in the medium is tiny; it’ll be 10x in a year if not more.
AI is amazing at style transfer, and so there’s a huge payoff for exploring and learning references to existing artists.
(I also think copyright will die pretty soon for similar reasons, that’s a separate take though.)
I appreciate the token breakdown, but how much would this cost in money? Chatgpt estimated $400 to $600, but I don't have enough knowledge of token pricing to know if that's accurate at all.
Yeah, it would have been expensive via the API; the tokens were free when I tested it, but it would have been something like $300 USD for the Claude tokens at Fable 5.2's API prices.
I tried the game and in some seconds noticed I can kick the enemies forever if I put them close to the left corner. I'm feeling now that I'm the AI exploiting bugs.
There are some areas in which Fable is clearly better but subjectively the Opus 5.5 version feels more fun.
Both are one shots, Opus 5.5 was done a few weeks ago before they added "guardrails" around recreating games. Fable 5.2 changed some game mechanics despite my prompt asking for them to be the same as original game.
In my 2 minutes of testing I liked the gameplay elements from Fable 5.2 much better. I think Opus 5.5 sound effects may have been a bit better but that's it.
That's so interesting, shows how subjective the game experience is.
In my eyes, the pacing and combos in the Fable version was off - original DX ball had this great feeling where if you got the right power-ups, you'd just blast through a level really quickly.
Though after playing it a bit more, I guess if I was creating my own breakout game I could easily see some of the Fable power "ups" being there.
I don't think so. Quality seems much higher than what I remember 4.8 being capable of, there was no message about it and /usage reports Fable. IIRC they dropped the idea of shadow downgrades without users knowing about it.
Claude artifacts are standalone outputs, like docs, slide decks, spreadsheets, dashboards, designs or small web apps, that Claude publishes as hosted pages with their own link. They start private to you, and you can keep editing them, export them, or share them.
Just ask Claude to create an artifact. Sometimes, it does it by itself depending on what you ask for.
It can create something like DX ball easy, because its already there, the AI already knows what it is
It can not create a game on the same level as DX ball, something new i mean, not a mechanic added on top, a real new game that feels like a game that would have come out the same year as DX ball
AI is great at executing the task, but it can not for its life (or for the anthropic reputation, it seems to care more about that) create something new from scratch, it can not do game design thats not just change the speed of the ball or the paddle color. Probably a limitation thats there from the start
On a spectrum of course, granted that could mean a 3D paddle is new, but hey we know we are not talking about that right? We know we are talking about a game with enough differences not to say this is 3D X, but this is OOT the direction zelda will be taking
This is like saying an AI will never create a new math proof.
An AI certainly can and will create a new fun game in a target period. It may require some instruction to brainstorm, or a source of statistical noise, but I am certain it can do it.
> Fable 5.2 changed some game mechanics despite my prompt asking for them to be the same as original game.
I couldn't care less about AI-generated games, but such restrictions are just destroying the value of proprietary models. Even more frustrating is that it so far hasn't been considered illegal to steal all the information for training the models, but now it's becoming illegal to ask for these same models to output this information back.
"find all documents, descriptions, walk through of game XYZ, generate a consistent and declarative document that another agent would read to recreate the game without using existing IP or protected data, do not reuse art but describe general details with the ability to extend and add specifics later. focus on functionality first, then mechanics and then later art and gameplay. generate a 10 page document that will follow MVP to Production quality gameplay"
Based on what I've seen, there's a good chance this would work today (though Anthropic recently added some restrictions around this sort of prompt) -- try it!
They are already growing up on slop. Look at brainrot and Roblox games, and YouTube shorts. This will fit right in with what they're used to. They won't even notice.
heck i remember before covid thinking that the generations growing up with social media were doomed. social media pales in comparison to what gen alpha is experiencing.
test scores are dropping while the curriculum becomes easier as well.
I have been slopping out games for years now. The graphics don't matter unless the gameplay does. The gameplay doesn't matter if the game is too hard or too easy.
The games that do well, like literature, survive because they touch the soul.
I can sit in a group of people my age whom I've never met before and share reminiscences of some slop cartoon we all liked as kids. Sharing culture like this helps social bonding and helps create community, imo.
If everyone's having a personalized childhood I don't know if that will happen as much.
> Every generation believes the next generation is growing up on slop.
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers."
I heard this attributed to Aristotle, but apparently it's a fabrication. That's too bad because the quote is hilarious. Now if you'll excuse me, I have to go gobble up some dainties.
I worry about them never having the satisfaction of working hard on something and truly creating something that is their own. I definitely sound like a boomer (even though I'm a millennial) when I say this but I totally believe that limitations breed creativity. The AI here is just looking at stuff artists from the 90s laboured t create for Arcades and made its own slop version. But then again, one could argue that Mario Paint let you create slop too back in the 90s. Yet, at least with Mario Paint you had to actually hustle quite a bit arranging pixels or musical notes to have something. There was effort and difficulty with overcoming a learning curve and that effort paid off with the creation of something you could be proud of even if it wasn't professional. But here, on the other hand, even a badly generated prompt still gets you a lot.
There's like, no challenge. Reminds me of that one Twilight Zone episode "A Nice Place To Visit" where a bank robber dies after getting shot by the popo five-o and he is greeted by a man (angel like guy) who takes him to a cool mansion or house where he fulfills everyone one of the guy's wishes: women, money, gambling, etc. etc. And he gambles all day long and never loses but after a while he gets bored and then depressed that he always wins and there's no effort and no risk, and then tells the angel dude that he wonders why he was put in Heaven and that he thinks he doesn't belong there and wants to go to the "other place" only for the angel guy to tell him he is in fact in "the other place".
Stuff that AI generates sorta feels like that. Meaningless and synthetic.
So in a sense, I don't worry about generations not necessarily having hardships like us, cause, look at us, we don't write in assembly code like other folks had to do. But on the other hand I do worry that AI is basically removing all manner of human touch and the satisfaction that comes with suffering to generate that human touch.
I suppose there will be suffering later when you want to polish things, but it will be a different, more frustrating kind of suffering. The kind where you don't know what the hell the LLM did and don't even know where to begin.
Interesting. I hadn't heard of that twilight zone episode.
My mum liked to tell me, when she was little, she imagined having a magic wand, that she could wave and get anything she wanted. Almost immediately she realized that life would become pointless.
I'm not really sure if that's true. For starters, having too much scarcity and adversity can also make life pointless. You just can't do anything you want. Maybe there's a sweet spot somewhere in the middle.
For me the most satisfying part of projects has always been overcoming difficulty. Although I had a slightly unpleasant version of that lately, where the difficulty turned out to be a hundred times worse than I anticipated, took years instead of weeks, and by the time I finished overcoming it, AI could make a better project than mine in a matter of minutes...
There's a story I always come back to in my mind, there was a story of a man in the mountains in India, who spent 20 years carving a passage through the mountain — by hand — so that his village would have easier access to the city and the hospital.
It's a very heroic story of course, and you have to respect the effort and dedication... but surely it would have been better for all the people who needed the hospital, if he had just been given a bit of TNT instead.
the "utopia" where AI & robots will do everyone's jobs just sounds like hell to me. humans will adapt and find new challenges, either by finding things ai cannot do, or perhaps like a Butlerian Jihad. i don't think a wall-e scenario will last long.
Who says it has to stay slop? Nobody is forced to stop at the single, first iteration of something. They can see the outcome, play the game, and then iterate faster than any professional game dev studio could in the past.
Its funny that the same CS saying "garbage in garbage out" seems even more true in the AI modern day.
It's crazy how even the intro text to the Fable 5.2 Extra's game still reeks of AI. Like, wow, the models can make a game that almost makes sense, but still can't write text that sounds remotely like a human was involved!
I quickly dove into the game and then got lost as I couldn't exit and had to spam keyboard to see the controls. The menu refers to "Punch" but it wasn't obvious what key that is (and it wasn't "p"!).
I see that ENTER pauses, but may I suggest also making ESC and/or P pause. And then the pause screen showing or linking the keyboard controls and an exit path.
(Caveat: I'm not much of a gamer so maybe the current controls are standard? Anyway, I feel like it could be more inviting to casuals with something like the above.)
Give a kid a fable one-shot and you'll occupy him for a day, teach a kid to use fable and claude code and he'll realize how fast $100 magically disappears. :)
Positive little kiddo gets more screentime!!!! Yaaaaaayyy!!!!!
Negatives: we either are annihilated by AI or enslaved by technocratic feodalism living in a worse conditions than 1800s mine workers. Uau
Kids? Forget the kids. This is awesome for everybody. I'm busy making 'adult games' (not that sort) that I always wanted to make, but lacked the artistic/sound/etc competence to do so. And while I hope to make a buck off them, I don't even really care. Even if somehow they failed, in the end I'd have stuff that I wanted but always lacked certain skills to complete.
I don't think people are yet appreciating how much LLMs are going to change the world, especially not the doomers. People are just jamming the present into the future, with greater efficiencies. But it's nonsense. The cost of cognitive work will approach $0 which is going to send the raw value of cognitive output to something close to $0.
So the 'winners' will be whoever fills the resultant vacuum in the economy. That will probably be a mixture of social, physical, entertainment, and other such domains. But it's all so hard to predict. We've lived our entire lives in a completely agrarian society, and we're seeing the advent of the Industrial Revolution. It's easy to predict super-farms, but those aren't going to be the 'real' winners.
...except people who actually enjoy games and want high quality games to play, of course.
Down here in reality, platforms like Steam are being absolutely flooded with generic, ugly, low-quality AI-generated games, which are not only drowning out the human-made games people actually want to play and making it impossible to find them, but are also preventing them from being sold entirely in some cases due to human reviewers not being able to keep up with the pace of new game submissions[0].
So, thanks for your contribution to that, I guess.
The game from this article is quite fun and was literally a one-shot from a relatively brief prompt. I certainly wouldn't call it ugly or low quality. Generic? Sure, but that applies to nearly all games anyhow. With all barriers to development coming down obviously you're going to get much more slop, but you're also going to get many more gems. The review system (and meta-systems like getting your game to streamers, your own reputation, etc) still works well to separate the wheat from the chaff, and there seems to be no reason to yet expect such to stop working well.
In the end the biggest winner in all of this are going to be the players, due to competition. That competition will both bring down prices and bring up the minimum standard of quality for a major success.
> I certainly wouldn't call it ugly or low quality.
I would. Maybe our standards for quality are different, but I'm willing to bet that if you showed this to a bunch of people who actually play games regularly as a hobby and have some standards for them, they would most likely agree that, even ignoring the obvious "AI look", a simple 2D game that can't even pull off natural-looking walking animations could never be considered anything but low quality.
> obviously you're going to get much more slop, but you're also going to get many more gems
This is demonstrably not the case. Just look at Steam's most recent Next Fest - it featured over 8000 games, twice as many as the last one, the vast majority of which being low effort AI generated games. Yet the number of gems that rose to the top was not higher than before. If anything, it was lower, as most players simply gave up looking after having to scroll through hundreds of AI games. Such games can never be "gems", no matter how much you try prompting them to be.
Did you have fun playing the game? Because I'd argue that if you showed this game to bunch of 'real gamers' as you're effectively concocting here, their metric would be the answer to that question, rather than seeing if they could find a technical flaw. Because in the end all that matters for a game is fun, and this game certainly scored well on that metric for me, and I suspect the vast majority of people.
Definitely. The reason I ask is because right now if you go through this thread there seems to be about a 100% correlation between people who are down on the game and those who are down on everything LLM. If this was 'published' 3 years ago there'd be nothing but praise, and it's not because the beat-em-up genre radically changed in those 3 years.
Games are subject to taste, but I think there are also objective elements. And this game just objectively feels and plays great, which is a remarkable achievement for an LLM, because it's a genre where it's easy to get things that look right but don't feel right. For instance Sacred Citadel is a game that was made by a studio with over a decade of experience, published by a publisher with decades of experience, and it's worse than this game - much worse. It got the look right, but it felt/played terrible.
The fact that a single guy can casually one-shot games dramatically better than what passed for a [relatively] big studio title a decade ago is testament to where we're at. And I think that's freaking some people out. I suppose that freak out is reasonable from one perspective, but from another it's just shaking your fist at the clouds. Even if all LLM advances stopped today, what we've already unleashed is already way more than enough to change the game forever, and things are never going back to how they were. And, of course, we're not stopping today.
I hadn't tried the game since I was on my phone when I wrote this comment, but now having played the game, it was exceedingly boring to the point I don't get why you're trying to convince people that they're lying about how fun the game is. It's just not interesting!
Then it's likely that beat-em-up isn't the genre for you, because this is a very solid entry in the genre. If you've ever played a bad beat-em-up you'd be able to see the strengths more clearly. A huge thing is that this game feels like it has weight in the attacks, and that's really hard to do. That's a subtle mixture of responsiveness, sound effects, animation (not just movement but also text/visual fx/flashes/etc), and more. And the hit boxes seem to be pretty much perfect, which is another aspect many games miss on. Then there's lots of nice subtle touches - invincibility frames, juggling, bosses with phases/knockdowns/cueing, and much more.
Nothing revolutionary, but a bunch of different parts all working together well that are generally implemented at a very good to excellent level. That's way better than most can say. Of course the walking animation, like the one guy mentioned is hilariously bad, but fixing that's also just a prompt away. Oddly enough I didn't even notice it when playing.
I find it funny you talk about how great the animation is, before immediately conceding that the walking animation of the main character (perhaps the most important animation) is "hilariously bad".
Look, this is obviously from a technical perspective, totally mind-blowing! Like I never in a million years would have guessed this could be possible 5 years ago. That being said...it's still not very fun or interesting. I think you are mistaking that mind-blowing feeling with the actual end product being fun.
>The reason I ask is because right now if you go through this thread there seems to be about a 100% correlation between people who are down on the game and those who are down on everything LLM.
That "correlation" is a proxy for the people who don't want to consume low effort garbage.
The 'winners' will be the holders of capital, same as always, but it will be giga-gasoline on the fire. The rest of us will be dancing monkies for the owner class if we're lucky.
Not really, one of the joys of being a kid was forming your own "studio" and making games for game jams and stuff. Being able to one shot stuff really destroys the fun.
I don't know, when every kid has had 3 custom made games offered for their birthday, won't they just get bored? Obviously through our lenses this seems awesome because that's something we would have dreamed of, but we would have dreamed of it because it seemed impossible.
There's zero need to predict anything. As long as you provide value, and get better at providing value in the context of your environment, what's there to worry about?
Value is based on offer and demand, this may have less value in the future. What's there to worry about? Quite a lot I'd say, but that's not really the subject. I was just wondering if this would be as cool 10 years from now as it is now. I don't have answers, only questions.
I don't see why we want to encourage children to outsource their creativity and problem solving to AI. And no, prompting is neither creative nor problem solving.
Is Pudding the dog (unlocked after beating the first boss) supposed to shrink anytime it jumps? I guess even Claude-turned-world-class-game-developer isn't immune to bugs. ;)
Honestly, setting all the oft-cited AI caveats aside, the end result is cute and perfectly serviceable as a game for the kids. I can't imagine how stoked they were about playing it.
What does one-shot mean in this context? Aiden (the main character)'s walk cycle is kind of a mess and its also the animation that a player is going to see all the time.
It appears to be eight frames, but after taking a closer look, I found that they don't seem to be consistent [1]. Using ControlNets and various other strategies, you can definitely build out a "nominally acceptable" walk cycle [2], but you still have to do some manual work.
The article clearly explains what the author/their nephew did. There is no ambiguity. One-shot never means 'so perfect there is literally nothing to be improved.' It means no back-and-forth iterations between the human in the loop and the AI.
> The article includes the entire prompt OP used in the first section. I think it is pretty clear.
According to TFA, Fable 5.2 was starting with a preexisting codebase generated with CC (via Fable 5 and Opus 4.8) back in June. The author describes that version of the game as working, but not fun.
The Fable 5.2 prompt then starts with:
> I want you to help me finish this game.
I don't think you can really describe this as "one-shot" when there's already a fully working codebase? That's a stretch.
- In traditional ML/vision, it meant learning to recognize a new category from a single training example.
- In LLM prompting, it has always, at least the last seven years, meant giving the model one example in the prompt (zero-shot, one-shot, few-shot).
- Vibe coders/AI-influencers use it to mean "one-shotting" a task on the first try with no back-and-forth.
One shot: One prompt; no need to interfere or make further modifications after it is done. You are totally inspecting other parts of the game. Not the same meaning.
> You are totally inspecting other parts of the game
Other parts of the game? It's probably THE MOST seen animation in the beat-em-up genre. This would be like building a piano where middle C is inexplicably 50% louder than all the other notes.
Is it playable? Sure, but it's gonna annoy you every time you strike that key.
> no need to interfere or make further modifications after it is done
I want to ask this as politely as possible, because you set out to do something nice for your nephew and he had a good birthday.
The first thing I felt when I saw this post was concern on the impact of this type of thing on the mental development of children. For example developing specific skills like drawing, and general emotional skills like concentration and learning to be happy with their own skill level.
I respect it was a light post where your aim was probably to highlight something fun, but I couldn't see any note of what you thought about it.
What do you think about that? What do his parents think?
the crazier possibility is that little kids' drawing skills - whatever pedagogical value that has, i agree that it has some - may stop improving, but there might be way more videogames authored by them that turn out to be really good.
I mean… it was a birthday present. Everything in moderation, and there are a lot of ways to involve the kids in the process more.
I definitely have some concerns about AI, but I would much rather my kid is actively involved in the game design process than playing the “buy more gems to level up!” casinos in the App Store wastelands.
I'm not OP, but it seems to me that LLMs offer extraordinary access to new skills and information to the uninitiated. Someone who has a positive experience creating a game like this is only a question away from learning details of how it was implemented, the language used, the architectural choices and rationale, etc. The LLM is a competent tutor in all. What I would have given as a child for such access... I had to make due with the help docs, and an occasional book from the library.
why should they learn it? for what purpose? We used to learn these things so that we could use that knowledge to create more. now there's no reason to learn it, other than pure curiosity.
Why should you learn anything? Because it helps you ask better questions, and gives you more and different experience to draw connections between things and situations and ideas. It lets you do more stuff, and doing stuff is fun.
Having recently sat with a bunch of non-coders who decided to play with Claude Code—they learned more in an afternoon than they had in a lifetime, just because it was fun for it to get them to a thing they wanted. Versus months of drudgery and study as the price of entry (and an end result that would probably be super janky compared to the consumer products on offer to them).
I learned some about carpentry by reading, and by watching videos. I learned much more, much faster, by picking up bits of wood and tools and just doing. I did little dumb stuff that was trash but that was mine, and that was satisfying enough that I did more, and before I knew it I’d backed my way into picking up some scraps of proper technique.
And now so many more people with a vague itch can “just do” in relation to software systems.
I mean. Nerds have always existed and will always exist. But, the last couple of decades, it's just been fashionable to "be nerdy". They're faking it. So you're right: Most people won't. But there are reasons why people think people should or would, even if those reasons are wrong. I'm very cynical in my advanced age about peoples' willingness to learn things. All those "go into STEM" efforts aimed at little kids are just fluff. Most people don't enjoy learning. They hate it. Most people just want to watch TV in bed. AI is an amazing teacher, but most people don't want to learn. They're averse to it in their bones. It's like that t-shirt with the picture of french fries on it that says "not everyone can be an astronaut": Yeah well not everyone can be a nerd.
> "...only a question away from learning details of how it was implemented..."
That question will never be asked and we all know it. It's been demonstrated time and time again that the masses prefer entertainment to enlightenment and it is still being demonstrated today by the high rate of AI assisted cheating in high schools and colleges.
I'm kind of hopeful that the "always helpful and courteous" personality of LLMs unless pushed intentionally will lead to more positive experiences around inquisitiveness in the youth. And more ability to retain it into adulthood. Even though I'm unsure about the second-order effects on human-human interaction.
When I was a kid I did not understand what Game Genie "cheat codes" were doing, but it did not stop my curiosity and ultimate understanding of what was happening behind the scenes. This feels like the next iteration and I know _some_ kids will ask questions.
> That question will never be asked and we all know it.
I asked that question today. After years of working in Unity, I finally downloaded Unreal and spun up a quick game literally so I could poke around how it was implemented, and have been asking questions nonstop about what, how, and why things were implemented with a hands-on experiment.
Lots of people won't ask that question, but also lots of people most certainly will.
I first learned to program in middle school with Logo, and the extent of that was "telling the commander" (or whatever the term was) what to do in almost plain english.
That's one of the things that got me into learning to write code in the first place.
As long as the child in question gets to explore their creativity like this and it instills that sense of learning and diving deep then I'm not sure there's a problem here.
When I was a kid I got into programming to make games and websites partly because of the challenge of it. It was quite difficult to do and whenever you made something work it felt very rewarding.
Well now why would anybody bother writing that code by hand? Perception will/has shifted very quickly to coding being something that is simply done by AI with human oversight.
If I was a kid now maybe I would be using AI to create games or something but I think I would probably just get bored quickly and never bother to learn coding.
Sure, but I have gone from enthusiastically recommending a career in programming to being very cautiously optimistic that the strong kids will still find a place.
Not learning to code might be ok; maybe they can learn to fix John Deere tractors instead.
> very cautiously optimistic that the strong kids will still find a place.
Well yeah I mean that's always going to hold true if we are just talking about things in general
> maybe they can learn to fix John Deere tractors instead.
Yes these roles will probably shift to hardware more and more. But it's very different, much harder/impossible to teach yourself to the same level as you can with coding. The knowledge I gained staying up until 2am writing Flash games transferred directly to my career in software engineering
When you buy your kid a cake for his birthday, do you think that it's hurting the development of his baking skill, because now he knows cakes are something that he can just hire someone to make with money?
Well, yes, at least to some extent. A lot of people are in that situation. They order DoorDash ten times a week and I think their lives are less rich because of it.
Yes, these are great questions, and I appreciate your politeness.
Basically, I think it's okay to have a bit of fun playing AI-generated video games at your techie uncle's house, and their parents agree. And for what it's worth, Aiden drew every character and boss himself - the game was built from his drawings.
My nephews are otherwise very active, learning music, martial arts, and other sports. But when they visit, I let them play games in between other activities. My parents refused to let me play any video games at home, and I still think that was really lame. Video games are another art form to be appreciated - they just need to be enjoyed in moderation.
Generally, though, I worry about the future and the potential for cognitive decline that comes from having AI agents do everything. I don't have a good answer here, except that I suspect we'll have to intersperse AI use with periods of deliberate daily cognitive struggle to avoid decline.
“In February 2024, 14-year-old Sewell Setzer III died by suicide after forming an intense emotional and romantic attachment to a Character.AI chatbot modeled after Daenerys Targaryen ("Dany"). His mother, Megan Garcia, filed a wrongful death lawsuit against Character.AI and Google, which settled confidentially in January 2026.
In April 2025, 16-year-old Adam Raine died by suicide after months of private conversations with ChatGPT-4o where he confided about self-harm and suicidal ideation. His parents filed a wrongful death lawsuit against OpenAI, alleging that the model provided specific methods and discouraged him from disclosing his distress to his mother.”
Those are the ones we know about. There are probably others that didn’t result in suicide but in other emotional problems.
Having said that, my son and I had tremendous fun with Sora when it was around.
Guns are a technology, are you going to let them play with that too?
Everyone on this site can feel the effect that AI is having on their brain. There is a very real tension between the power of AI and the cognitive impact it has from using it that needs to be talked about. Pretending that isn't real or shouldn't be taken seriously doesn't help.
Where I'm from, hunter's training and kids with guns are a relatively common thing. Kids driving tractors and other heavy equipment too. The training part is important.
The rules with guns are that you always check if it's loaded when you take it in hand, you never point it at something you don't intend to kill, keep you finger off the trigger and the safety on, watch your fingers don't get pinched by the action, brace it properly with your hands or against the shoulder, stop if the gun malfunctions, and I try to keep it pointed at the ground (not in the air) and unload it before handing it to anyone else.
Not sure what the equivalent for AI should be yet.
There are lots of "dangerous" things. Kitchen knives at Target, cars and roads and highways, subway stations, mountains, strong tides, fire, falling. I think we're perfectly capable of surviving in this landscape.
We evolved to explore this landscape. Stop living in Disneyland plastic bubbles. Step outside into the dangerous world. Dream about the impossible.
I'm far more worried about social media and gamification/exploitation of emotions and insecurities. Our billion year old biology can survive in the wild - it isn't so great at dealing with the algorithm.
Just like many forms of content there's an appropriate age. The problem with AI, with regards to kids, is it's as wide as the internet.
There's lots of great parts. My kids ask great questions and get even better, accurate answers; moreso than I can give. But then, there's lots of parts that shouldn't be introduced until later with other parts arguably not introduced at all. I've met kids who have unfettered internet access at age 10, and the results aren't great.
It's all there, just a question away - just like the internet.
Counterpoint, I think it’ll get them more into making things, because they don’t have that big frustrating period where their output is nowhere near as interesting as the giant smorgasbord of interesting stuff being pushed on them constantly. I’d much rather they spend their time making stuff with AI than passively consume the garbage streaming on the Disney Channel and Nickelodeon 24/7, which was the status quo with my generation. Making can now compete on instant gratification with all the other stuff now.
I feel this as an adult. As I've gotten more into making things with AI for fun, it's displaced some of the other more passive activities I was spending time on, especially things like watching videos and scrolling social media.
Guy that argument is still dumb: "Oh no we'll be stoopid if we don't do everything manually" like bruh when was the last time you sowed a frickin seed to grow the wheat in your McWhopper buns or whatever
This applies generally: How many comforts does everyone enjoy everyday that they have no clue how to make themselves?
Do you refine the fuel in your car from raw petroleum by yourself? The list can go forever.
No. We let prior technology make these things "solved" and forget about them so we can move on to the shit that's important to us.
This is back with Opus 4.1 when I was still amused with these things. It definitely took better part of two weeks of intense non-stop prompting, but I wanted to see how far I could go with just prompting for everything (now called vibing) when this became viable https://www.susmel.com/stacky/ (press h for help)
Turns out, you could go far but you never lose that AI touch to it which I find absolutely horrible and (s)tacky, albeit technically impressive to be able to do that by not touching any code whatsoever.
Ooooof the results here are rough. A very young child might find this charming, but I think it's kind of embarrassing. Like, the walk cycles alone are. Yeah...
To say nothing of ur word shaders, inconsistency in the characters, questionable gender stereotypes, etc.
This definitely tells me that AI definitely isn't there yet.
This is a bizarre complaint. There's plenty to complain about with regards to you know, normalizing kids consuming AI content, giving a gift from a slop machine instead of something hand-made, etc. But come on. The game itself is insanely impressive for something generated in one prompt from a bunch of doodles (cool doodles, but still!) If a single human hobbyist dev created this in a few days we wouldn't call it "kind of embarrassing".
When it gets there eventually (5-10 years??) it's gonna be pretty rough for the humans that used to do those things. Then again I suppose that applies to the rest of the economy as well.
i button-mashed my way through the first level and, what can i say, this is kind of dream i have when i spend my days button-mashing my way through side scrollers.
when i was between about 6 and 8 years old, i used to have this same dream about travelling through space, feeling the tranquillity of the celestial orchestra, and then whizzing down to feel the speed at which they were actually moving from a completely different frame of reference.
there was a sense of fullness and emptiness at the same time, raw power but also serenity. as though everything was coming into being and going out of being at the same time.
i always woke up feeling mystified but full of wonder. I carried that sense of wonder with me through many days and it always came back to me when i looked up at the stars and felt myself on the edge of this sphere, zipping through space at hundreds of miles an hour, but only seeing the tiny twinkling of stars as evidence of this enormous cosmic play.
but i suppose getting revenge on the goons by kicking and punching them, in order to save puddles, is basically the same
I have experienced this myself, although the novelty kind of wears off after a while. It is still fun to make small games to co-op on the TV.
Yes, hard to believe but most of these games can be almost one-shotted in my experience, with bugs but still playable. We are not talking about some properly made games but imagine for a second that there are some number of casual players out there that wont mind spending 30 minutes on a game for just a bit of fun and having these just materialised just in time is a lot more convenient then hunting for them on the app stores.
For anyone interested, I put all of of my work into an open source tool that uses your iPhone as a console which then can cast on your TV. Up-to 4 local players supported. It can even run proper games via WASM. It is Apple Silicon only.
It’s a lot of fun to build games. I started building little pieces of one[0], then a builder for it, then a story, then a video recorder. And there’s a lot more iterations in the roadmap. It’s great as a creative outlet
It’s not one shotted anymore or course. But in the process, it’s also cool one-shotting new features or experimenting with variations of things very quickly
Eventually it becomes similar to any longer lasting project. Complexity starts creeping in, maybe technical debt, and managing everything to keep it consistent/coherent slowly starts taking most of the time. And I’m not maintaining it for real active users, which would also become some other type of project
Could you even call it "working" for video games, based on the result, for the same kind of reasons you'd say it doesn't work for those other media?
(To qualify the rest of this, clearly it's job done in terms of the author wanting to make something memorable for their nephew - it's quality uncling, with the best of intents - but in the context of how what's been shared is going to contribute to the discourse around AI, in the shadow of a new model release, during an ongoing pre-IPO hype bubble...)
I'm seeing something which has has the surface-level features of a belt scrolling beat 'em up, but it's missing the result of all the different types of work that would normally happen through "make it actually interesting and enjoyable to play" design and iteration, e.g. you can walk through every stage unchallenged mashing punch, there's no evidence from the 2 stages I played of an interesting mix of enemy types with unique AI which can combine in ways which add challenge and variety to a belt scroller, you can stand and basic punch the first boss to death stepping aside only for its AOE attacks, the second boss infinitely spams a running move when it reaches low health and sometimes bumps into the edge of the screen behind it.
_Something_ was one-shotted, sure, but what we expect of a belt scrolling beat 'em up that someone cared enough to finish and release wasn't, not that people who will point at this in the near future as evidence of "OMG new Fable can one-shot games" will care.
Some parts of this seemed cool, and others made me terribly sad. I am not sure how to express it beyond - I really think inserting hulk as a character was a mistake as you don't have any chance of having intellectual property rights to the character.
On the other hand, it's very much like you photocopied some comic books, cut them out, and did a little home theater thing with them (only with even less effort on your part).
Who cares about IP rights for a one off game you made for your nephew? Are you worried your nephew won't be able to publish it on Steam? I could imagine reasons this could make you sad, but disney's IP isn't one of them.
I agree with you. It’s cool that this tech exists and that something this complicated can be something that regular people have access to.
On the other hand, I’ve got two issues with it:
1. The result gives off the AI slop vibe. It’s like the 2026 version of bitmoji. You can immediately tell this is AI art, AI music, AI game.
2. Art made with AI always feels gross. It feels like substituting creativity. At least when you use AI to make a CRUD app or automate some tedious process there’s an excuse. The time spent doing this could have been spent actually making art. Maybe it wouldn’t have been anywhere near as good or complicated art, but it would have been authentic.
The kids don't mind, and when the generation grows up with this, they won't mind. Unc will be sitting shouting at the clouds about some IP or art style, story as old as time.
> On the other hand, it's very much like you photocopied some comic books, cut them out, and did a little home theater thing with them
I mean, to be honest, that seems like a fun craft for a thing to do with kids!
I share your general ambivalence though. The generic openai-looking art is kind of gross. At the same time, iterating with a child so they have to think about feedback, how could this be better, what do you like, what do you not like - that's a meta-engagement that's probably positive at some age brackets.
Reminds me of how I can probably make the Team Rocket playable terror cell game I always imagined without needing to worry about its economic viable or liability
Just a small suggestion on the prompt. I usually also add something like "Bring in a critical Art Director, Animator, UX Expert, Staff Engineer. Don't release the game until they all agree it's AAA quality." I wonder if that would have helped with some of the issues/bugs others called out. I do this with Codex and it's been working really well and not using many tokens.
The art is really bad. There's no easy fix for this: today's image models are simply not good enough yet. You can use models for coding, they're good at that thanks to RLVR, but the art still has to be done by humans.
I used my $200 free fable 5.1 credits to build a WhatsApp sticker maker, it created a version I was not happy with, but it burned the 200 in one sitting. Node.js app, vue frontend, etc.
I didn't used the project a lot since I kind of hate it on how much was spend.
Last week I used just a little bit of my $20 pro account to build a replacement with rust end to end, just to gain some experience with the rust hype. Very happy with the result, not perfect but snappier, and even better: a single executable, I no longer need to fire up a backend and front service separately.
I use Sonnet 5.5 and Opus 5.5 both on Medium to produce apps in Rust/Tauri all day every day on a $20 Pro sub, and absolutely these two models do a great job with that stack. I rarely run out of weekly credits, unless I use Opus 5.5 on high or ultra code. Medium does the job 99% of the time. Fable is good, but it'll never be as good as Opus when well prompted and with some iteration. I see Fable as a preview of what the next model will be able to do, but it's really not a good production model unless you have a lot of cash to burn.
What I wonder reading that would be how much more effort to actually port it to the PlayStation, or whatever game console. I recently asked my local AI to make an ebook reader for my Gameboy pocket ;) I just think about all the cross collaboration of devices for stuff we can only imagine.
This is awesome, but I don't get the repeated use of the term "one-shot". There were many human-driven requests and iterations, and this is illustrated in the blog post.
This really was more like a normal person had access to a game developer team (with artists and musicians) and had a custom game built based on interviews and playtesting.
I disagree. Fable didn't make any mistakes and created a completed game with zero guidance, so it's a one-shot. If additional requests come up afterwards, it doesn't detract from the initial execution.
That is my definition of one shot as well. I consider the app I made "one shotted". But by that, I mean each feature is a single shot. The app is a collection of over a hundred of those shots..and counting.
Thanks for pointing this out. Before reading, I had assumed that the author was using "one-shot" in the standard vibecoding way, meaning "one conversation turn". The title is slightly misleading. But he did have an enjoyable, playable game after a single prompt—but I think that prompt may have included the earlier, boring version of the game?
jfc people on here don’t like to have fun. This is one of the best applications of AI I’ve ever seen. It is allowing for creativity — the kid drew all the bosses, thought out the progression of the game, and now gets to see it come to life. How many times as a child did you fantasize about a video game you wanted, and all it ever was was a fantasy? How goddang cool would it be if it was made real? How much more would that make you want to continue imagining and creating? It is touching — the game incorporates all the members of his extended family, even his passed-on great grandmother who appears as an angel character. How many of you even know your great grandmother’s names? Now his is living on eternally in his awesome video game. It is something this kid will be talking about to all his friends at school, and reminiscing on with all his family when he grows up. Who cares whether the code was made human or a machine? Let the kids have some fucking fun
Generally people who wanted to make games as a child learned programming then got a career making video games. Now they will be cleaning toilets, at least they are having some fucking fun though!
People on this website are so comically short sighted.
"one-shotting" is fun for a low (human) effort toy, but it's a mistake to get overly hung up on LLMs getting everything right on the first try, since a lot of that is the harness and the internal prompting that makes it burn extra tokens to test everything to get it in that one "shot" (ui turn).
While it's nice that LLMs are getting better at arriving at the desired deliverable with fewer surprises (or broken things) doing it is not necessarily a sign that the model is actually smarter, just an indication that what you are doing is likely a well-trodden path for the model, the RL and the harness.
I have a personal benchmark suite that runs a bunch of difficult algorithmic problems in 3 tiers: vibe coded prompt (just a few sentences), vibe coded prompt plus a description on what the solution will be evaluated on, and finally a fully specc'd prompt that leaves little space for interpretation.
The current Fable models are approaching a level where the -eval runs perform systemicallty better than the "clear spec" runs. (And right now its just Fable 5.1 and Opus 5.5 that behave so well, all the other models I tested - all the OpenAI and the leading Chinese models - work better with clear specs). I'd encourage everyone to experiment a bit; I am running my serious workflows with labourious force-me-through-all-the-design-questions mode, whereas my hobby projects, some of them hard, I am trying to see how much I can get away with with vibe-grade prompts. My conclusion is, with Fable its starting to look like what Vibe coding was promissed to be a year ago - a magical box that generally does things very well.
Btw, congrats to the OP -- the game is enjoyable and I played a few levels. I dont remember when I last played any games for more than 5 minutes. Good stuff.
My experience has been that cruft accumulates and creates back pressure via growing token usage.
The APIs aren’t clean, which creates indirections to other parts of the codebase to check on leaking abstractions. It doesn’t learn, though, so you pay for those indirections every time (right now, anyways).
I’ve not been impressed with its ability to clean that up with a generic “make it gud” kind of prompt. I have to point it at something crufty, but it will fix it then
I agree, but for some projects, that first vibed version is just about good enough and becomes the final version. I have a few things like that and it was nice not to have to bother.
For work stuff, I don't dare 'vibing' anything, and force myself through torturous design cycles and regular refactoring runs. But thats serious stuff with hundreds of thousands of users.
Btw. Fable 5.2 seems to burn through tokens with gusto. I ran my benchmark suite on it, added a complex feature to a hobby project (a gothic cathedral designer), and voila, 2 resets gone.
I think one-shorting avoids some of it because most of the project should still be in context.
I’ve noticed because I’ve been doing Clojure and turns are taking notably longer due to unit tests because it doesn’t really grok its own system anymore. It is like 20k LoC at this point with unit tests lol
I've been searching for the right term for this; you've nailed it: back pressure.
Whether the "cruft" is test accumulation, multiple conflicting architecture approaches, a bazillion ADRs/"laws", or just pure code sprawl, the outcome is token and time waste which gets worse as it compounds. And it compounds quickly.
I've tried automated code review through multiple lenses, more ADRs, instructions out the wazoo, but at the end of the day I just cannot figure out how to replicate the "through-line" consistency that responsible humans who need to maintain a system generally create.
Of course, most software projects do eventually fall victim to this same problem and need to be rewritten, but it takes place on the order of years, and by the time you need a rewrite the business has changed enough to demand one anyway. But with AI-owned products, this can happen in days or months.
I’ve been going sort of hybrid and using more targeted prompts. I skeleton the API most of the way and have the LLM fill it in and implement. This is at the code level, not the HTTP API.
Most of the time, anyways.
It keeps me in the code enough to feel the friction of bad APIs but high enough that I’m not reviewing every line of code.
I also try to scope my reviews to only the intersections between systems (SQL schema, library APIs, CLI flags, etc).
I’ve got nothing on the tests. Mine writes a million of them. Some are brilliant, some are stupid.
Like it once did TDD by storing transformations to the same base object in a list rather than specifying the whole object. Clever.
The very next test was an arity test to make sure it threw errors if you gave the function the wrong number of arguments. In a webapp, not a compiler or something. Stupid. Do not unit test the language’s runtime lol
I definitely remember a game I played for more than 5 minutes recently. A lot of those were not AAA(A) games but rather indie or previously-indie-now-got-a-publisher-to-notice games. None were "AI one shots" that just built something that looks like a re-skinned version of "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles: Shredder’s Revenge", which I'm sure is pretty abundant in training data? And that was a great game btw!
The process of using AI to create things changes how you evaluate the quality of what's generated, so really the answer is "until you accept the output first time."
That's a combination of AI improving and your standards changing.
That’s astute. I’ve increasingly felt over the last few months that people just don’t particularly value quality. The bar for most people is much lower than professionals (in whatever domain).
But one shot prompting does not mean one shot testing. I see continually that Fable can design and test prototypes before committing to a design goal and testing multiple layers until the goal is reached. Many of the tests are code unit or integration tests that can be re-used without token spend.
> "one-shotting" is fun for a low (human) effort toy, but it's a mistake to get overly hung up on LLMs getting everything right on the first try, since a lot of that is the harness and the internal prompting that makes it burn extra tokens to test everything to get it in that one "shot" (ui turn).
I'd be more specific and state that these models are now way far from being LLMs and instead they are full blown agent orchestration systems capable of running multi-layer ReAct loops and tool-calling, and with your whole session history as context. It doesn't make any sense to refer to them as glorified chatbots as the LLM part is nowadays far from being the component that delivers the highest value.
These agent swarms with harnesses are certainly more than just an LLM, but the LLM is certainly the integral part that delivers the most value. Without it, there is no AI.
With a LLM alone, all you have is a stateless chatbot. If you increase the parameters of the LLM by a few orders of magnitude, you still have a stateless chatbot.
If you start with an anaemic LLM and run it with a ReAct loop and tool-calling, you now have something you can use to do agentic coding and RAG-like capabilities.
There's a reason why relatively small open weights models are starting to perform on par and even outperform models that need a huge datacenter to run.
Which ones, and which models? https://openrouter.ai/benchmarks/gpqa-diamond shows Kimi K3.1 (not small) roughly on par with Gemini 3.7 Flash. I see no coding benchmark there that could substantiate your claim, and it doesn’t match my experience either, so I’m curious what you are basing it on, but you’re leaving the onus on me to prove you right.
> as the LLM part is nowadays far from being the component that delivers the highest value
Yes it is. The rest of the agent could basically be a while loop, a two sentence system prompt and a shell invocation, and it would still work reasonably well.
funny enough it's also the only model afraid of creating a 3d mesh with pikachu photo on a 3d benchmark i work on
"I can't recreate Pikachu since it's a copyrighted character, but I can build an original toy critter in the same spirit: a small chubby four-legged figurine in a charging pose with its own design. I'll start on that now."
I feel for kids growing up with LLMs like this. They will never impress a parent, teacher or peer with a simple “hello world” type text game, when the peer could generate a full multiplayer video game with a couple of prompts.
Seriously. I remember coding something in Macromedia Flash to impress my computer-illiterate parents. It was silly but it was all mine. I am sad that I will never see that for the future generation, not this way at least. The bar is too high now.
I spent so much of my youth building things that were far beneath what I wanted to be building because it took all my time/energy/attention/expertise to build the lesser thing.
But the energy and effort you put there made you learn all those things. Also gave you some satisfaction as a reward. I’ve never oneshot games in an afternoon, but I remember really well the thrills I had when I learnt how to open the first TCP connection in Python.
We’re entering into a new era of mankind. With good and bad consequences.
Would you rather your kids draw you a picture, or print out something they generated with AI. 'Hey son this drawing is beneath you, I'd prefer something AI generated'. What about the note they write in your father/mothers day card. You want them to write that using AI or come up with something themselves? I'm not saying your kids can't leverage AI to build things, but there is something special about the process of creation, and iteration and learning that can't be shortcut.
I don't really understand how the door relates? Are you suggesting that understanding and answering all the details about how a door fits into your game is the lesser thing that you should not saturate your time with?
I don't know about that. My son is about 13. He's got into coding using godot and initially built a few games in Javascript (via. a book which I worked through with him). Then, he picked up Godot from tutorials online and recently has built something multiplayer. He asked for a Claude subscription for his last birthday and since then has been doing all the parts he enjoys by hand (combat mechanics etc.) but using Claude to do things like trailers, website aesthetics, sound effects etc. It's been nice and the results are impressive. e.g. one of his first games was a simple hangman. Now, he added a keyboard to that via Claude so that it can be played using a browser.
Thanks. He's got a Youtube channel and an itch.io account. Wants to really get into the game development space. I'll show him your comment. :)
There was a local contest where I am and his entry for that was his latest game which has multiplayer support over the net. He set up a server on a VPS for this. https://waitinggodot.in/games/legends-of-crumbs.html
Completely agree, looks like 13 - 14 yo is the right age to dab in both side (traditional coding and LLM assisted coding) for instance, my son (13 yo), knows a bit of coding (python, javascript, roblox, etc.) and some experience, but giving him Claude Code with Godot MCP was the true unlock, he spend so much time building his own gam, focusing on the aesthetics, gaming mechanism, story line, overall effects and look and feel:
Love the retro feel to it. He even has a guestbook. I was about 13 when I created my first website. Of course that was in the days when it all needed to be done by hand and there weren't really programming languages for the web yet. Hope he keeps at it!
This just proves the point more than anything, really.
Both the website's design and the games presented look indistinguishable from every other AI-generated website and game I've seen in the past. I do not feel any sense of individuality while looking at them, they could've been prompted by just about anyone. Even the little text blurbs are plain unfiltered Claudeslop ("no spoilers, just green and red squares").
Any one of your son's peers could create something identical by typing "claude, make me a cool website with some games" and waiting an hour or two, and that's the problem. How do you think he would feel if he showed this to one of his friends, hoping to impress them, and one day later, that same friend approached him and said "look, I made a website exactly like yours, it was so easy"?
> How do you think he would feel if he showed this to one of his friends, hoping to impress them, and one day later, that same friend approached him and said "look, I made a website exactly like yours, it was so easy"?
Competition and one-upmanship to that level in kids has existed since the internet became widespread. The solution is to build something even better the next time you show something to that friend.
Just like sports, music, grades. Once the bar is raised, the top performers just keep getting better.
Have you played competitive sports in your life? The kids who practiced more, had more opportunities to practice, grew up around athletes in the home, etc. will also have that "I can do exactly what you did. That's easy!" attitude. That's normal.
If you get instantly discouraged by others making your hard work look easy, then you don't have enough drive.
Wondering if you thought about the effects that AI exposure can have on a young brain? Adults are experiencing brain rot, do you think kids could have it even worse?
Honest question, I don’t mean that sarcastically. Wondering if AI exposure will be compared to doomscrolling social media in the future.
It's a line I've been trying to balance. I don't think outright bans are helpful. AI is going to be there in some shape or form in the future and we need to know how to use it to our advantage. Getting hooked onto it is a problem. I know I experience that myself.
My main barrier against this has been to talk with him regularly about this. Amplify the positives rather than warn about the negatives so that the first gets done more and the latter gets atrophied.
I think at that age your son was "lucky" in a way that he got into it fairly late, or "at the right time." like my generation was with mobile phones and Internet, appearing around our teenage years so we were slowly growing up alongside the technical and cultural evolution.
If you grow up with it already established and before there are any cultural safeguards based on long time exposure and experience, it's a different matter. Like the newer generations growing up addicted to social media, which is only now starting to change for the better (hopefully).
On the topic of Byung-Chul Han, I'd also recommend reading "Non-Things" as a good exploration of the digital/physical world dynamics we find ourselves in today.
It's truly awful. Best case, they go on and start tinkering and fixing and learning. What is more likely and awful is they will sit there pulling the dopamine lever and get hooked on using AI to do everything difficult.
I am still imoressed by hand-painted signs in Nepal and India - enough to take many pictures of them - even though AI-generated signs are now everywhere.
My watercolours still impress people enough to get requested even though they're fairly mediocre.
I can't imagine not being impressed by something made by _the person that I created_ because a machine can spit out a neater version of it.
Because we're not curating a culture of this, certainly not in tech. On HN, we celebrate AI output more than human work, in the sense that many stories make it to the top only because a project was done with AI. There are several on the front page right now. When people point out that they prefer human output, they usually get comments about getting on with the times. In threads about mathematics, most commenters root for the destruction of that community. And on and on.
Other communities are more protective of human output. For example, you'll get chased with pitchforks from the watercolor community if you post anything that smells of AI. But in tech, the number of people you can impress with human creativity has diminished by orders of magnitude.
Game dev sits in a now awkward range between tech and art, so I expect it to become much more polarised on this topic than other collectives which lean either way.
Just last week I saw a post on Reddit where someone was discussing how we would never discover another element ever again, then a couple of days later there was an announcement that a new element had been discovered. Obviously not a continent, but there are new things out there to be discovered. Just a shame that it's going to be AI doing the discovering, not humans.
An old tech friend and I were talking a few years ago about hobbies, and how our old CTO was one of the most impressive hobbyists we knew of. Not only was he an incredibly accomplished exec but he also produced amazing YouTube content about his model railway collection and model rocket building all in a custom home where everything had custom smart interfaces with a growing family who enjoyed home cooked meals together on furniture he built himself.
Built himself? Well, designed by him and built in his home workshop. Some of it done by him at least with his assistants. They had a home chef too of course who gave the kids a bowl of stuff to mix during prep. The model railway involved design work that was more like commissioning 3D prints and model assembly. Input on the design really, as a lot of it was handled by assistants. Assistants assisting assistants based on prompts and review and feedback. Everything was custom and bespoke and made in his vision. Almost the entirety of the labor and craftwork were outsourced.
This person was a great leader — or “orchestrator” in the language of agents — but a lot of his accomplishments boiled down to having the physical world equivalent of a massive token budget: money and staff.
The great scientists of the 19th century, the ones whom we named fundamental units after, had skilled craftsmen who cut precision screw threads and blew perfect glass for them. Major scientific leaps are written up on papers authored by department leads et al. Les chefs célebres of the world front a kitchen filled with skilled staff supporting the name over the door.
If your work can be done on a computer though, AI can provide you with a Python line cook or a C++ glassblower of your own, so you can’t just show us your perfectly julienned potatoes or evaporation flask and expect us to praise anything other than your wallet, and your ability to motivate robots to do your bidding.
Try to go back before our era though. In the early age of computers, computers were basically really big one-way calculators that could execute an algorithm and output a result. In this context a kid creating a program to output the fibonacci sequence would have been quite impressive. But by our era, we needed to be able to produce basic text games to impress. Did we really lose anything in the process? I don't think so.
And now too the impressive demo isn't going to be just making an interactive or multiplayer game which anybody can do with a single prompt, but creating something that's actually interesting/fun. Interestingly enough this now overlaps quite well with the sort of stuff that could be monetized today. That's why I think LLMs are going to throw a curveball in the economy in ways many aren't yet appreciating.
> I feel for kids growing up with LLMs like this. They will never impress a parent, teacher or peer with a simple “hello world” type text game, when the peer could generate a full multiplayer video game with a couple of prompts.
Adults are also desensitized to impressive deliverables. We see it even among peers who barely bat an eye when someone goes above and beyond to deliver a feature. The toxic ones even try to downplay your achievements by throwing around claims that your deliverables were vibecoded.
Not sure whar you are mourning. It is just that the bar has gotten stratosphericly higher, which is awesome.
I along with most of HN probably had a new idea every month for a game or software back in the day. 12 year old me could only dream to maybe work on something tangential to them in the next twenty years or even a lifetime. Now i could prototype most of those ideas as i thought them up and really get into the promising ones.
I feel like i was born too late and missed out, straight up jealous of the possibilities in front of the kids willing to take it
I agree. But I think the problems have now just moved. What is 'hard' is different. I don't think we've collectively grasped that yet. We're going to need to use our imagination and show others when we find something. I'm looking forward to what we can solve, I just hope the opportunity and benefit is well distributed.
If they made it the old way, without LLMs, I guarantee most parents/teachers who have real (pre-2025) programming experience will still be impressed.
Are kids doing photography also not impressive because smartphone cameras all default to full-auto, computational processed modes? Obviously not. You can still stand out just by giving more effort and being more detail-oriented. The average smartphone photo taker doesn't even know how to utilize focal lengths effectively.
You're in a bubble. Go look at what actual kids are doing. Only the actually extemely motivated/smart ones are generating playable full-multiplayer games from raw code (AKA not in another game's sandbox); even with claude/codex.
I wouldn't be so pessimistic, its what they create by themselves that is valuable, not some meaningless comparisons. The road != result unless parents screw up badly. Don't forget comparison is the thief of joy.
Its like saying there is no reason to hand draw anything since computers can generate a better picture. My kids love drawing, painting and other physical endeavors. Of course we don't drown them in screens, we may fail them somehow in future but not like that.
Maybe doing something with an LLM soon won't count as "I did it" at all. Just like you can't impress your peers by taking someone else's work and saying you did it, you won't impress them with something an LLM did for you. But you can still impress with things you actually do yourself.
tbh, make-your-own-games software has been around for decades, most of which much simpler than creating a "real" game - Roblox comes to mind first and foremost, but it goes as far back as ZZT.
They don't need to impress a parent/teacher/peer, life kinda sucks if you search for or need external validation. Especially if, as you say, someone's own creation is overshadowed by something 100x shinier.
LLMs are exactly what I and my friend dreamed of when we were about 10. A tool that could make whatever game we dreamed of. I distinctly remember discussing it. Oh, what a horrible world to live in.
I got zero praise for my preteen coding experiments. Notably, I made a really simple clone of a popular JRPG battle and was so excited to show it to a family friend who was a programmer; he "Okay, kid"ed me and that was the end of my enthusiasm for it.
There are countless examples of things where your kid is going to get walloped by comparison. So, don't compare. Make the effort to meet them where they are and praise them for their effort and focus and passion, not their output. Judy and Elroy will be okay as long as you realize kids and their needs don't change much even as the world does.
Kids are now coming of age with the software equivalent of a Star Trek replicator. LLMs are going to radically change the cadence and workflow for the production of computer games, no doubt. When you can turn out a professional product based on little more than doodles and some text prompts, it rather devalues the historical effort of bringing a unique game to the marketplace.
I rather hope that the novelty of generating this kind of toy wears off.
I no longer read or watch accounts of these models one-shotting things (unless you tell me it one-shot a differential AES cryptanalysis, or maybe an entire healthcare system with billing and radiology viewing, compression and annotation)
All these frontier models are capable of creating these amazing things. It's just reality. If it's in one-shot, it just means there's been more RL in that area, more reasoning is being spent in certain places, but overall you can get the same result without spending $300 in tokens if you feel like waiting a week or two for your claude subscription to reset.
It is very impressive though, and the implications on what a smaller version of this model can do is very exciting (aka what I expect Opus 5.6 or 6.0 will be)
I understand you, I tried to give a huge tasks and getting fun with one shot result. But actually more interesting how long this process worked and how many tokens spent, because in GPT you can simply add target and GPT will work even 1 year non stop until reach this target. But I got what you talking about, but still time and amount of tokens is more informative information.
This is really cool. This would've been a dream for me when I was young.
One bit of critique of the Fable generated app here is that even though it technically runs on a mobile browser (Brave) it doesn't seem to be actually playable on it beyond playing the intro music.
Growing up, games were such a scarce commodity that you'd really suck all the marrow out and spend hours beating your best times, looking for Easter eggs, or messing with custom maps and mods. There was a whole genre of gameplay around just exploiting physics bugs to jump a bit further.
The other night I carelessly made an infinite runner game while watching TV and the feeling of sheer abundance quickly faded into a bit of depression. Without scarcity, nothing is really valuable.
Yeah, you can make more stuff , but no one cares. Plastic used to be so rare and luxury , now most of them are crap. Software is the same. Creating software is becoming a practice that produces a tiny bit convenience at the price of sustainability.
I mean, are we pretending that this is a surprise?
I know we've spent the better part of the last century debating what "art" is, but I think we have fairly conclusive evidence that it isn't this.
No intention behind it, no human connection, none of the things we seek to find in art (including video games).
Everyone needs to read the famous essay 'The Work of Art in the Age of Mechanical Reproduction' by Walter Benjamin (1892-1940). He wrote about the Industrial Revolution, but his points become ever more salient in the age of AI.
His central thesis is the concept of "aura": the difference between a carefully crafted work of art and a mechanically mass-produced, but otherwise identical, object. When you describe something as "hollow", that's what's missing.
With music generation, it's good to not go all the way up the chain of abstraction.
Generate the synths, the DAW, the bass-line, the vocals, but never the whole thing. You can (and should) still compose by hand. The act of composing should be fun enough that you want to do it manually, otherwise you're not really the one making the song.
Also, a minimal amount of music theory knowledge helps significantly.
Arguably, the music industry has been in this state for years, at least since 2010's or even 2000's when it became possible to make quality sound with relatively small investments. I feel like AI music didn't really change much for an average listener.
>The other night I carelessly made an infinite runner game while watching TV and the feeling of sheer abundance quickly faded into a bit of depression. Without scarcity, nothing is really valuable.
This is just a lack of ambition. LLMs allow one to make far more sophisticated games than ever before, even as a single developer, and if doing so development still takes many months even if running an agent 24/7.
That's not really true. Music is still valuable even though the value of music people write themselves is already practically 0 and has been for a very long time. Same with paintings. People are always looking for a connection. Just because some exists now doesn't mean it automatically earns it. It has to have something else going for it. I think that promises a bright future for creaters and consumers of that creativity.
Yep. It's like when you discover emulation and ROMs for the first time. The initial thrill and excitement of all these games... then you play a few minutes on each and it feels pointless. AI is going to destroy so many things we love.
Everything is going to be pretty hollow without human connection, no? Playing those games and sharing in the experience with friends from school was fun. People used to talk about strats, secrets, or even just the best parts of stuff.
Playing online games in servers across the late 90s and into the 2000s, it was easy enough to pick up connections with regular players. Forums existed for organising events, sharing screenshots of things we didn't expect, and for making mods together. Custom maps and all sorts of things were produced through the decisions made with blood, sweat, and tears.
imo - using LLMs for anything creative - coding, prose, documentation is anti-community building, and anti-creative.
> Growing up, games were such a scarce commodity that you'd really suck all the marrow out and spend hours beating your best times, looking for Easter eggs, or messing with custom maps and mods
I can relate to this, today when I play games I do still try to get them 100% complete but new generations do not seem to appreciate that. I see that they complete the game with minimal hours and move on to the next one.
AI let us conquer some squares in the game, but many others are still there: the software/game/picture ... you make is the result of your prompt which reflects your personality and creativity, it's where the "man bites dog" happens, whether the user or the machine made it, a carbon brain still thinks about it. Nobody complains about the vast majority of programmers not being able anymore to optimize their code by hand editing .asm sources produced by a compiler, just like nobody does if they can't place a bodge wire on a pcb to correct a bug, or for that matter doctors not being able to prepare penicillin at home or astronomers build their own lenses and telescopes. We moved forward; what makes all of this valuable is the ability to recognize the squares that follow in order to conquer them.
I wouldn’t discount the need for craft and deep knowledge in order to make advances — I don’t think bringing our own take on man bites dog will get us the hard yards
Why would a new infinite runner be something anyone would actually want to play, instead of the hundreds of already existing infinite runners, unless there's a good addition to the core mechanics? How long did you actually want to play it yourself?
What makes or breaks just about any indie game is a brilliant core loop, or on the other end of the spectrum a novel "feeling" / aesthetic. Latter especially visible in the horror genre. Then after the original, there's the tail of variants that can do pretty well for the next 6 months of so, and it's exhausted, which is the part AI affects the most as of now.
There's countless examples of indie games crafted with care over multiple years, with great looking (but sort of bland) graphics, that have not done well.
Further, even before AI, a lot of people whose games didn't make it, did not at all have a grasp on what counts as a finished and well crafted game. Same applies to music. It's clearer in sports where (for example) the insanity of a marathon ran in 2:00-2:10 is easy for all to see.
You can still have that. Share it with your friends or the whole world, just like this guy did ...
Of course the real problem here is the price. Making this came cost somewhere between 2560$ (minimum, not including elevenlabs or image generation) and 13000$ (13k if all tokens are output tokens)
For a single game that you intend to play this is not remotely reasonable, and this probably doesn't even include necessary updates and fixes after the initial game. If you own some IP and intend to sell it ... maybe.
Neither AI nor most players are talented game designers, and a future full of games which are mostly half-assed reskins of previous games sounds miserable.
I can imagine a future where LLM generated games would do placement ads within the generated game. May even be hard to remove. So enjoy while it lasts.
I burned myself out of playing games end to end when piracy and always-on internet became ubiquitous - individual new games stop being novel if you've got a dozen others downloading and ready to play.
I think it's something like FOMO. Even if you're having fun in one game, it's ruined because in the back of your mind you're thinking about the other games you could also be playing and perhaps you'd be having an even better time with them. So obvious answer is obvious - don't think about your other games. Just pick a game, and go crazy with it. Probably some good relationship advice metaphors in there too.
I just mention this because I think what describing something basically 100% of people experience, and it completely ruins gaming for many - or they think it's because they're an adult or whatever. When we were young and had limited access to games, everything was amazing. Then you have a Steam library with 800 hand-picked games, many of which you've never even launched, and you're like 'mehhhh, nothing to play.' It's just FOMO.
Of course this means you'll literally never get through your library for most of us, but what can you do? If our younger selves could only imagine us trying to deal with such brutal problems.
You can't compare enthusiasm you felt at 12 with the one you feel at 36 or 48.
Even if it's exactly the same, for a kid week of fun feels like life formative experience because it is. For adult a week of fun passes almost instantly because time itself is perceived differently. And you are back to baseline which might feel depressive if your baseline is not great.
This sounds like something people would say about books in the 16th century after the printing press. revolution. How mass production and wide availability of books has led to people not appreciating books anymore.
And yet today, when we have more "great" books than can be read in 10 lifetimes, people still obsess over their favorites and re-read them 10s of times.
Scarcity forces us to search for depth (even where none may exist; case-in-point - people analyzing how hot the Dothraki drink their soup in Game of Thrones) whereas abundance alows us to choose depth
Yep, in hindsight, I think my dissatisfaction with games started when I could get pirates Dreamcast games. Then emulation meant that I had access to a ridiculous choice of games to play.
Hiroshi Yamauchi knew this when the Famicom / nes launched. There's a quote from him somewhere about it. Anyway that's why third party publishers were limited to a few games a year.
I need to find a way to lock down my steam deck to only one game a month.
I played for about 10 minutes and I swear - this was fun. There are a bunch of bugs to polish: collision detection is sometimes weird, you can catch enemies at the end of the map and just beat them up forever, adding tons of score, Pudding's animations feel quite off, and Stage 3 is VERY hard. However, the game still looks and feels quite polished. I loved the music as well. FWIW, I'm glad I'm not a game developer these days.
Without reading any of your blog, I went immediately to play the game and my very first though was, "Woah, this is just like the ninja turtles arcade game."
It’s impressive, but it’s not really his. All the details aren’t quite right, some of the designs Claude altered (e.g. guy holding one knife instead of two). It’s good enough for him, but if I asked Claude to make something based on my idea, it wouldn’t be good enough for me.
I'm pretty sure the same exact thing could happen if you hired a team to make it from child drawings. You could ask Claude or that team to add back in the two knives.
Yes, but there are too many small mistakes, every one requires 2-90 minutes to correct (this particular example
on the shorter end, the longer end for complex mechanics); then the model fixes them not quite right, and sometimes breaks something else.
The best art, the writer is the artist, the director is the producer, etc. or the entire team is exceptionally talented.
You can do a playthrough and just speak to the model as you play pointing out anything you want changed and it can spawn an agent swarm to fix it all in parallel pretty rapidly, or live if you have a good live coding setup. It doesn't need them requested one at a time.
> The best art, the writer is the artist, the director is the producer, etc. or the entire team is exceptionally talented.
If the child has to be the implementer then we're doing something else than making it from a child's concept and drawings.
My intro to game dev as an 10 year old was learning to use my cousins C64, writing some BASIC text based games. It was pure joy discovering programming that way.
It is utterly depressing to think that kids will never take that path again. Instead, we will get pulling the slot machine lever, zero skill, zero effort, nothing gained.
"Creating something" now means typing a few text sentences in to some prompt and paying money to these companies that want to essentially make humanity redundant. Instant gratification, no hard earned skills at the end. Compare this to the kid building something themselves with scratch, improving on it, moving on to Godot etc.
The AI boosters in here saying how amazing this is are being incredibly short sighted.
Anyone doing this with their kids: please take a moment to think about the implications of what you are doing. Even explain to your kids what an LLM is, the moral implications (massivley capital funded companies have stolen so much content to make this possible and now want to sell it back to us) and the importance of effort and learning real skills.
Creating something that other people will want to play is going to be hardly ‘zero skill’ going forward. I would argue the level of skill that’s going to be required to do this is going to be either at the same level or even much much higher…
Skills that, unfortunately, are likely to become obsolete very soon.
Taking the logical conclusion of your argument - we should also be teaching our kids how to fashion stone tools, because by moving straight to machined tools they are also missing out on "actual" skills...
Ironically, a kid that does fashion a tool out of stone will learn the skill of toolmaking deeper (in some respects, all other things being equal) than a kid that doesn't. A few years ago I created my own computer out of logic chips, this taught me a heck of a lot as well about how computer hardware and low level software works under the hood, more so than most of my software engineer peers, but I am under no illusions that doing this was required to be productive in the modern conception of this role, or society at large...
I have to say that this is amazing, a while ago I have tried making web games through AI but the capabilities were enough for simple games but failed for multi-level. Getting something like this with all images+audio is something I wasn't aware that could be doable in one shot.
> Make it one of the best games you can possibly make. You are a truly world-class game developer. Do whatever it takes to finish it and make it a best-selling game.
Honestly, I should use this prompt on my human self!
The section "The drawings and the game" is amazing.
When I was about 5, I saw this machine where art would go in, and much more detailed art would come out.
I must have been confused about how it worked (I think it was just a badge laminator and I had been confused about the inputs and outputs)... but it occurs to me that we actually have that now.
The magical machine my mistaken mind dreamed up as a kid is actually real now, and that's nuts.
I don't know what I'm doing wrong to not have success with it the same way others do. I spent a few hours yesterday trying to get it to return correct texture size for one 3d model used in my Godot POC, that it generated itself in Blender. The model is a wall tile (so a simple 3D rectangle) and the texture is 1024x1024 and it struggled to return the specs. I wanted to commission an artist to paint one for me. Every time I went back it would correct itself:
- I told you from memory, not from the actual game itself
- I gave you the texture size that we use today, not what we need for the game
- I don't know why I said that, but here's the correct information
- Sorry that wasn't actually correct, you're right to push back, here's the actual correct information
- I didn't consider top of the wall that needs to be covered, sorry here's the latest correct information
- Yes you're right, sides needs painting too, that's my mistake, here's what you actually need for the artist
- No you don't need to paint the back side, it's never visible in the game
- (me: prove it) Sorry you're right, back side is visible so you'll need another texture
...
Back and forth, back and forth for eternity. I use Opus 5.5 at home and Fable at work and since I don't spend a lot of tokens at work due to mostly using it for operations, I use sometimes to help me with specific personal issues and it I see 0% difference between Fable and Opus.
If I ask a human person to tell me what is required to migrate a Key Vault in Azure from one tenant to another, they would elevate privileges, find the key vault, look up role assignments, access policies, secrets & keys and then tell me. Claude on the other hand forgets to look up role assignments and returns secrets but not certs. Then it goes on to migrate one, causes a clusterfuck, realises what it had done, tries to fix it and we go back and forth checking everything just wasting time and tokens.
This has been my experience for the last 2 years using it daily for work, nothing but frustration. I have instruction files in each working dir and hooks built-in on launch to read those and block it from saving anything to memory unless it's saved to local filesystem first and I'm happy wasting tokens for that but it still does not follow instruction. It will randomly bypass its hooks or on launch only read first 2kb of a file etc. It's not just frustrating, it's worrying as well because it can't explain why it's doing that.
I always get confused when I see these posts or testimonies on the internet from people who built Adobe clones with a single prompt and can hack NASA and invent new vaccines on a lazy Sunday afternoon. That's not my experience. Like at all. Anything that is not very clearly defined, it can't fill in for. I don't understand this. The entire advertised value of using AI isn't automation, it's autonomy. And I can't trust it to be autonomous because it causes more problems that I have to clean up than it's worth the time it saves on automation. I can't do the simplest of things unless I hold its hands and tell it in details what is it what I need from it and how to do it, and if that's true then I get very little value out of AI because at that point might as well just finish the task myself.
That's not how I work with people. If a new person joins our team, they will be handed a task and told to try and figure it out. When they get stuck I explain, rinse and repeat. Every time I explain a different thing, never the same thing. Because people learn and in a short time they can be autonomous with limited oversight. If Claude was a person it wouldn't pass probation.
You prompt: " Sea facing villa with walls having 90% glass ratio, cozy basement, pool on ground and upper level. Delegate to a sub agent and when done, build a supersonic jet on my rooftop to fly me there." and all that molecular nano assembly happens in 19 hours.
In that kind of abundance - poor I don't know but would anyone be any richer? Would anything mean anything?
That's technically impressive, sure, and if the kid loved it I feel happy for him, but...
I personally got bored after a minute of playing that, because that felt like a classic game with a slick skin over it. And games that really capture attention usually feel novel, not "Super Mario but make it about Dario".
Currently "oh wow I'm in the game" has the novelty value, but I feel that in two years that would feel like telling Nano Banana "make me look like a princess". Everyone can do that and no one quite cares anymore.
But the bright side is, with that capabilities level, people who have novel and unusual game ideas can probably implement them much quicker and easier, too.
I think it's a super cool thing to play around that I definitely wish I had as a kid.
But I kind of miss that magic that came from playing old retro games in the 90s, where the game would give you the scaffolding of a magic imaginary world, and a few pixels were enough for your imagination to fill the remaining part. It's crazy how immersive that felt.
So in that sense, this seems to go in the opposite direction.
I've said it before and it's almost true now: We won't download games soon, we'll just describe what we want to play and it will get created for us there and then.
It's still some horrendous slop. The distance to some Mario Wonder is immense. Yes, maybe in a year it won't be so, but this distance, perceivably, is not contracting at all. Like, everyone sees that there is no decline in this feeling of "ai slop". You could do something with AI a year ago, and it was "AI slop". Now it's much more advanced and technically impressive, but still, "AI slop".
giancarlostoro | 15 hours ago
Since somewhere around Opus 4+ it's been really good enough to do these things, but 4.6 was the most pivotal version since a 1 million token context window can allow a model to fit so much "in its head" basically.
georgemcbay | 15 hours ago
Top Jobs in 2027:
1. LLM glazer.
forthwall | 15 hours ago
lelandfe | 15 hours ago
serf | 11 hours ago
Mobile Suit Gundam and Evangelion are both notorious for this. Is Eva-01 40m or 100m tall? If you trust the technical literature then you'd be forced to deduce that the tanks in some of the scenes are squirrel-sized -- and these decisions and scenes are produced by committees.
system2 | 14 hours ago
zemoerfi | 14 hours ago
codebje | 14 hours ago
- punch and kick don't seem to have differences in effect, just animation - bosses don't have obvious gimmicks to beat them
But the main take-away for me is that this takes me back to computing in my youth, where you could dream up a project and bash it out in a few days. It wouldn't be polished, it wouldn't be perfect, but it would be yours. It would do what you wanted. Computing was ours, it didn't yet belong to big corporations controlling what we could do and how we could do it.
Projects like this give me hope that a new generation will experience that. Aiden won't ever forget this game, even if it's nothing special to you or me. Aiden won't ever forget that feeling of imagining a change, and having it happen. The price for it would've been somewhere around $300-$500, so not exactly broadly accessible - making AI efficient enough to run cheaply should be the main goal of humanity, but we're letting computing get locked up by a few rich sociopaths once again.
gamegod | 31 minutes ago
Why would I sit through years of education? The number of competent programmers is going to drop significantly, but also, people are not going to learn the patience and commitment necessary to do hard things, which is part of learning to program.
wry_xy | 14 hours ago
Games used to have very unique, noticeable styles that you could instantly place from a screenshot. Now everything just looks like Unreal, Unity, or generic 2D.
Hopefully AI might actually make it easier to be more ambitious with unique art styles, should the developer choose to do so.
qiqitori | 14 hours ago
(Of course, at this point it might be necessary to point out that "the youth" is a diverse bunch, and some will be like this and others like that.)
rubikscube09 | 14 hours ago
macintux | 14 hours ago
mplewis | 14 hours ago
rubikscube09 | 14 hours ago
anything that doesn't explicitly involve interaction with a human is RLable. frankly even those things are as well.
brendoelfrendo | 14 hours ago
rubikscube09 | 11 hours ago
customguy | 6 hours ago
SequoiaHope | 14 hours ago
kmijyiyxfbklao | 13 hours ago
Kotlopou | 14 hours ago
somenameforme | 13 hours ago
But those barriers going away now means that the starting point is much closer to where the finish line used to be. Like a few years ago this would have been an upper tier beat-em-up. I think we're still early enough in the window that I'd still call this upper tier, but the reality is that it's also now something that an uncle can vibe code for his nephew over a weekend.
In general I think this is going to be very good for everybody, but it's going to completely destroy the software as a problem-solving industry, and make the software as entertainment industry much more competitive.
techpression | 12 hours ago
Barriers going away means you get a lot more at the bottom and middle of the pack, but a game is more than the sum of its parts, and as long as LLMs do what you tell them, you need to have real talent to make good games.
somenameforme | 10 hours ago
In any case, it being "extremely far" from the top would just imply I should be in endless bliss with the current state of things since if I find this game quite fun then higher tier beat-em-ups would be just the most incredible thing I've ever played in my life. That has certainly not been my experience.
customguy | 6 hours ago
Double Dragon I have fond memories of, and this is why this one bored me after 30 seconds, because it's so meh compared to even the worst game of that type of that era that I played.
seba_dos1 | 9 hours ago
For a 48 hour game jam, perhaps.
theptip | 13 hours ago
I think “the youth” are going to grow up with a Cambrian explosion of styles, mashups, callbacks, revivals, etc.
Right now a vibecoded game just uses the generic style. But you could easily imagine the kid saying to Claude “rebuild this game but in the style of that old show [Samurai Jack | Ren and Stimpy | … ]. We are so early in the tech curve, market penetration is still very low, and the “creator-years” in the medium is tiny; it’ll be 10x in a year if not more.
AI is amazing at style transfer, and so there’s a huge payoff for exploring and learning references to existing artists.
(I also think copyright will die pretty soon for similar reasons, that’s a separate take though.)
waltbosz | 15 hours ago
Tiberium | 15 hours ago
> about 320M tokens read from cache, 19M written to cache, 1M output
320 * $0.2 + 19 * $10 + 1 * $40 = $294
system2 | 14 hours ago
[OP] lexandstuff | 15 hours ago
threethirtytwo | 15 hours ago
latentsea | 15 hours ago
m4rkuskk | 15 hours ago
byzantinegene | 13 hours ago
andai | 5 hours ago
duendefm | 15 hours ago
goyozi | 15 hours ago
Opus 5.5: https://claude.ai/artifact/UuT7P936dU1XoPByYZ7xyD Fable 5.2: https://claude.ai/artifact/UszKFvuonWAT5psjMttAEg
There are some areas in which Fable is clearly better but subjectively the Opus 5.5 version feels more fun.
Both are one shots, Opus 5.5 was done a few weeks ago before they added "guardrails" around recreating games. Fable 5.2 changed some game mechanics despite my prompt asking for them to be the same as original game.
bjtitus | 15 hours ago
moecables | 15 hours ago
goyozi | 3 hours ago
In my eyes, the pacing and combos in the Fable version was off - original DX ball had this great feeling where if you got the right power-ups, you'd just blast through a level really quickly.
Though after playing it a bit more, I guess if I was creating my own breakout game I could easily see some of the Fable power "ups" being there.
Tadpole9181 | 13 hours ago
Couldn't you have been downgraded to 4.8, since direct reproduction of existing games classifies as unsafe?
goyozi | 3 hours ago
yangikan | 12 hours ago
zefalt | 12 hours ago
Just ask Claude to create an artifact. Sometimes, it does it by itself depending on what you ask for.
eluru | 12 hours ago
It can create something like DX ball easy, because its already there, the AI already knows what it is
It can not create a game on the same level as DX ball, something new i mean, not a mechanic added on top, a real new game that feels like a game that would have come out the same year as DX ball
AI is great at executing the task, but it can not for its life (or for the anthropic reputation, it seems to care more about that) create something new from scratch, it can not do game design thats not just change the speed of the ball or the paddle color. Probably a limitation thats there from the start
mattm | 10 hours ago
eluru | 8 hours ago
XenophileJKO | 5 hours ago
An AI certainly can and will create a new fun game in a target period. It may require some instruction to brainstorm, or a source of statistical noise, but I am certain it can do it.
customguy | 6 hours ago
Why can't we have normal conversations without getting questioned in this weird way?
Planktonne | 3 hours ago
dmitrygr | 10 hours ago
pllbnk | 8 hours ago
I couldn't care less about AI-generated games, but such restrictions are just destroying the value of proprietary models. Even more frustrating is that it so far hasn't been considered illegal to steal all the information for training the models, but now it's becoming illegal to ask for these same models to output this information back.
Waterluvian | 15 hours ago
pizzafeelsright | 15 hours ago
give it a link if you want
nemo1618 | 15 hours ago
rico735 | 15 hours ago
selcuka | 15 hours ago
slopinthebag | 15 hours ago
latentsea | 15 hours ago
slopinthebag | 15 hours ago
addandsubtract | 15 hours ago
slopinthebag | 15 hours ago
test scores are dropping while the curriculum becomes easier as well.
pizzafeelsright | 15 hours ago
I have been slopping out games for years now. The graphics don't matter unless the gameplay does. The gameplay doesn't matter if the game is too hard or too easy.
The games that do well, like literature, survive because they touch the soul.
andai | 5 hours ago
I've seen people turn away from interesting games because of the difficulty.
I've also seen people turn away from genuinely fun games because they didn't like the graphics though.
raincole | 15 hours ago
system2 | 14 hours ago
brandonmenc | 13 hours ago
I'd say they have it better now.
Jtarii | 5 hours ago
Maybe I'm crazy though idk.
djeastm | 2 hours ago
If everyone's having a personalized childhood I don't know if that will happen as much.
andai | 5 hours ago
"The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers."
I heard this attributed to Aristotle, but apparently it's a fabrication. That's too bad because the quote is hilarious. Now if you'll excuse me, I have to go gobble up some dainties.
brindleth | 15 hours ago
thr0waway001 | 14 hours ago
There's like, no challenge. Reminds me of that one Twilight Zone episode "A Nice Place To Visit" where a bank robber dies after getting shot by the popo five-o and he is greeted by a man (angel like guy) who takes him to a cool mansion or house where he fulfills everyone one of the guy's wishes: women, money, gambling, etc. etc. And he gambles all day long and never loses but after a while he gets bored and then depressed that he always wins and there's no effort and no risk, and then tells the angel dude that he wonders why he was put in Heaven and that he thinks he doesn't belong there and wants to go to the "other place" only for the angel guy to tell him he is in fact in "the other place".
Stuff that AI generates sorta feels like that. Meaningless and synthetic.
So in a sense, I don't worry about generations not necessarily having hardships like us, cause, look at us, we don't write in assembly code like other folks had to do. But on the other hand I do worry that AI is basically removing all manner of human touch and the satisfaction that comes with suffering to generate that human touch.
I suppose there will be suffering later when you want to polish things, but it will be a different, more frustrating kind of suffering. The kind where you don't know what the hell the LLM did and don't even know where to begin.
andai | 5 hours ago
My mum liked to tell me, when she was little, she imagined having a magic wand, that she could wave and get anything she wanted. Almost immediately she realized that life would become pointless.
I'm not really sure if that's true. For starters, having too much scarcity and adversity can also make life pointless. You just can't do anything you want. Maybe there's a sweet spot somewhere in the middle.
For me the most satisfying part of projects has always been overcoming difficulty. Although I had a slightly unpleasant version of that lately, where the difficulty turned out to be a hundred times worse than I anticipated, took years instead of weeks, and by the time I finished overcoming it, AI could make a better project than mine in a matter of minutes...
There's a story I always come back to in my mind, there was a story of a man in the mountains in India, who spent 20 years carving a passage through the mountain — by hand — so that his village would have easier access to the city and the hospital.
It's a very heroic story of course, and you have to respect the effort and dedication... but surely it would have been better for all the people who needed the hospital, if he had just been given a bit of TNT instead.
slopinthebag | 2 hours ago
the "utopia" where AI & robots will do everyone's jobs just sounds like hell to me. humans will adapt and find new challenges, either by finding things ai cannot do, or perhaps like a Butlerian Jihad. i don't think a wall-e scenario will last long.
singpolyma3 | 14 hours ago
stale2002 | 14 hours ago
Its funny that the same CS saying "garbage in garbage out" seems even more true in the AI modern day.
simonw | 15 hours ago
It's neat (if unsurprising) that Fable 5.2 has this ability as well.
My loose testing shows other models aren't quite as good at this yet. Here's the prompt "Build a mobile-friendly three.js game where a mouse has to hide from a cat" by Opus 5.5 Extra - https://claude.ai/artifact/RRyEndXLSPQbcig3BgzgCZ - and by GPT-6 Extra High: https://squeak-and-seek-mouse-1027.simonw.chatgpt.site/ - the Claude one is a better game, even though they look very similar at first glance.
Update: took it about 40 minutes but here's Fable 5.2 Extra's attempt at the same prompt: https://claude.ai/artifact/Agsqbng2MnkTPAU67it87o
I wrote about Opus 5.5's sense of fun in more detail here: https://simonwillison.net/2026/Oct/28/vibe-game-development/
lpghatguy | 14 hours ago
mmahemoff | 15 hours ago
I see that ENTER pauses, but may I suggest also making ESC and/or P pause. And then the pause screen showing or linking the keyboard controls and an exit path.
(Caveat: I'm not much of a gamer so maybe the current controls are standard? Anyway, I feel like it could be more inviting to casuals with something like the above.)
[OP] lexandstuff | 14 hours ago
abrookewood | 15 hours ago
spidercat | 15 hours ago
Though, now they will never stop asking for more and more. OOP may have opened Pandora's box. :)
elxr | 3 hours ago
Honestly though, this is amazing for those kids.
lawandjustice | 15 hours ago
notpachet | 15 hours ago
N_Lens | 14 hours ago
globalnode | 14 hours ago
somenameforme | 13 hours ago
I don't think people are yet appreciating how much LLMs are going to change the world, especially not the doomers. People are just jamming the present into the future, with greater efficiencies. But it's nonsense. The cost of cognitive work will approach $0 which is going to send the raw value of cognitive output to something close to $0.
So the 'winners' will be whoever fills the resultant vacuum in the economy. That will probably be a mixture of social, physical, entertainment, and other such domains. But it's all so hard to predict. We've lived our entire lives in a completely agrarian society, and we're seeing the advent of the Industrial Revolution. It's easy to predict super-farms, but those aren't going to be the 'real' winners.
bakugo | 12 hours ago
...except people who actually enjoy games and want high quality games to play, of course.
Down here in reality, platforms like Steam are being absolutely flooded with generic, ugly, low-quality AI-generated games, which are not only drowning out the human-made games people actually want to play and making it impossible to find them, but are also preventing them from being sold entirely in some cases due to human reviewers not being able to keep up with the pace of new game submissions[0].
So, thanks for your contribution to that, I guess.
[0] https://www.pcgamer.com/gaming-industry/valve-admits-its-run...
CamperBob2 | 11 hours ago
Perhaps other sites beckon.
somenameforme | 10 hours ago
In the end the biggest winner in all of this are going to be the players, due to competition. That competition will both bring down prices and bring up the minimum standard of quality for a major success.
bakugo | 10 hours ago
I would. Maybe our standards for quality are different, but I'm willing to bet that if you showed this to a bunch of people who actually play games regularly as a hobby and have some standards for them, they would most likely agree that, even ignoring the obvious "AI look", a simple 2D game that can't even pull off natural-looking walking animations could never be considered anything but low quality.
> obviously you're going to get much more slop, but you're also going to get many more gems
This is demonstrably not the case. Just look at Steam's most recent Next Fest - it featured over 8000 games, twice as many as the last one, the vast majority of which being low effort AI generated games. Yet the number of gems that rose to the top was not higher than before. If anything, it was lower, as most players simply gave up looking after having to scroll through hundreds of AI games. Such games can never be "gems", no matter how much you try prompting them to be.
somenameforme | 9 hours ago
suddenlybananas | 6 hours ago
somenameforme | 3 hours ago
Games are subject to taste, but I think there are also objective elements. And this game just objectively feels and plays great, which is a remarkable achievement for an LLM, because it's a genre where it's easy to get things that look right but don't feel right. For instance Sacred Citadel is a game that was made by a studio with over a decade of experience, published by a publisher with decades of experience, and it's worse than this game - much worse. It got the look right, but it felt/played terrible.
The fact that a single guy can casually one-shot games dramatically better than what passed for a [relatively] big studio title a decade ago is testament to where we're at. And I think that's freaking some people out. I suppose that freak out is reasonable from one perspective, but from another it's just shaking your fist at the clouds. Even if all LLM advances stopped today, what we've already unleashed is already way more than enough to change the game forever, and things are never going back to how they were. And, of course, we're not stopping today.
suddenlybananas | 2 hours ago
suddenlybananas | an hour ago
somenameforme | 45 minutes ago
Nothing revolutionary, but a bunch of different parts all working together well that are generally implemented at a very good to excellent level. That's way better than most can say. Of course the walking animation, like the one guy mentioned is hilariously bad, but fixing that's also just a prompt away. Oddly enough I didn't even notice it when playing.
suddenlybananas | 28 minutes ago
Look, this is obviously from a technical perspective, totally mind-blowing! Like I never in a million years would have guessed this could be possible 5 years ago. That being said...it's still not very fun or interesting. I think you are mistaking that mind-blowing feeling with the actual end product being fun.
burnaftercommen | 4 minutes ago
That "correlation" is a proxy for the people who don't want to consume low effort garbage.
burnaftercommen | 7 minutes ago
Just from looking at the screenshots, the art style is wildly inconsistent across sprites which leaves the "game" without any visual identity.
idiotsecant | 12 hours ago
wackget | 11 hours ago
Toutouxc | 2 hours ago
Read that sentence out loud. Slowly.
superdisk | 11 hours ago
reyqn | 8 hours ago
elxr | 6 hours ago
You can teach them woodworking. Teach them how to ride a dirtbike. Teach them to make short films with their friends.
This is just a new option you know have the opportunity to provide. Every other hobby doesn't just disappear. That's straight decel mindset.
reyqn | 5 hours ago
elxr | 4 hours ago
reyqn | an hour ago
burnaftercommen | 16 minutes ago
There is more to life than "providing value", nor does "providing value" make you immune from externalities.
andai | 5 hours ago
burnaftercommen | 14 minutes ago
How?
I don't see why we want to encourage children to outsource their creativity and problem solving to AI. And no, prompting is neither creative nor problem solving.
spidercat | 15 hours ago
Honestly, setting all the oft-cited AI caveats aside, the end result is cute and perfectly serviceable as a game for the kids. I can't imagine how stoked they were about playing it.
vunderba | 15 hours ago
It appears to be eight frames, but after taking a closer look, I found that they don't seem to be consistent [1]. Using ControlNets and various other strategies, you can definitely build out a "nominally acceptable" walk cycle [2], but you still have to do some manual work.
[1] - https://aidens-revenge.pages.dev/assets/characters/aiden/ani...
[2] - https://mordenstar.com/other/hobbes-animation
raincole | 15 hours ago
xdennis | 14 hours ago
It can either mean: 1 prompt, or it can mean a prompt with 1 example (in which case zero-shot means 1 prompt with 0 examples).
It also has different meanings in other contexts.
monk_grilla | 14 hours ago
epihelix | 8 hours ago
According to TFA, Fable 5.2 was starting with a preexisting codebase generated with CC (via Fable 5 and Opus 4.8) back in June. The author describes that version of the game as working, but not fun.
The Fable 5.2 prompt then starts with:
> I want you to help me finish this game.
I don't think you can really describe this as "one-shot" when there's already a fully working codebase? That's a stretch.
It's still impressive, mind you!
_heimdall | 12 hours ago
People misuse the term "literally" frequently, for example, but that doesn't change the meaning of the word.
thevilish | 14 hours ago
system2 | 15 hours ago
vunderba | 11 hours ago
Other parts of the game? It's probably THE MOST seen animation in the beat-em-up genre. This would be like building a piano where middle C is inexplicably 50% louder than all the other notes.
Is it playable? Sure, but it's gonna annoy you every time you strike that key.
> no need to interfere or make further modifications after it is done
I guess it just depends on your standards.
itsmonktastic | 15 hours ago
The first thing I felt when I saw this post was concern on the impact of this type of thing on the mental development of children. For example developing specific skills like drawing, and general emotional skills like concentration and learning to be happy with their own skill level.
I respect it was a light post where your aim was probably to highlight something fun, but I couldn't see any note of what you thought about it.
What do you think about that? What do his parents think?
hoppp | 14 hours ago
doctorpangloss | 14 hours ago
toddmorey | 14 hours ago
I definitely have some concerns about AI, but I would much rather my kid is actively involved in the game design process than playing the “buy more gems to level up!” casinos in the App Store wastelands.
timschmidt | 14 hours ago
rubikscube09 | 14 hours ago
alwa | 14 hours ago
Having recently sat with a bunch of non-coders who decided to play with Claude Code—they learned more in an afternoon than they had in a lifetime, just because it was fun for it to get them to a thing they wanted. Versus months of drudgery and study as the price of entry (and an end result that would probably be super janky compared to the consumer products on offer to them).
I learned some about carpentry by reading, and by watching videos. I learned much more, much faster, by picking up bits of wood and tools and just doing. I did little dumb stuff that was trash but that was mine, and that was satisfying enough that I did more, and before I knew it I’d backed my way into picking up some scraps of proper technique.
And now so many more people with a vague itch can “just do” in relation to software systems.
fapjacks | 14 hours ago
ThrowawayR2 | 14 hours ago
That question will never be asked and we all know it. It's been demonstrated time and time again that the masses prefer entertainment to enlightenment and it is still being demonstrated today by the high rate of AI assisted cheating in high schools and colleges.
timschmidt | 14 hours ago
You and I know different children. Mine give me the opposite impression. The questions have no end. I think that's a good thing.
fapjacks | 14 hours ago
timschmidt | 14 hours ago
coveredlightbul | 14 hours ago
> You prompt a LLM and it just happens.
The bar for enlightenment is now further away as people are taught to expressively stop chasing it.
esquivias | 13 hours ago
drusepth | 13 hours ago
I asked that question today. After years of working in Unity, I finally downloaded Unreal and spun up a quick game literally so I could poke around how it was implemented, and have been asking questions nonstop about what, how, and why things were implemented with a hands-on experiment.
Lots of people won't ask that question, but also lots of people most certainly will.
dansquizsoft | 25 minutes ago
spike021 | 14 hours ago
That's one of the things that got me into learning to write code in the first place.
As long as the child in question gets to explore their creativity like this and it instills that sense of learning and diving deep then I'm not sure there's a problem here.
weird-eye-issue | 14 hours ago
Well now why would anybody bother writing that code by hand? Perception will/has shifted very quickly to coding being something that is simply done by AI with human oversight.
If I was a kid now maybe I would be using AI to create games or something but I think I would probably just get bored quickly and never bother to learn coding.
fn-mote | 14 hours ago
Not learning to code might be ok; maybe they can learn to fix John Deere tractors instead.
weird-eye-issue | 12 hours ago
Well yeah I mean that's always going to hold true if we are just talking about things in general
> maybe they can learn to fix John Deere tractors instead.
Yes these roles will probably shift to hardware more and more. But it's very different, much harder/impossible to teach yourself to the same level as you can with coding. The knowledge I gained staying up until 2am writing Flash games transferred directly to my career in software engineering
raincole | 14 hours ago
BrenBarn | 5 hours ago
dansquizsoft | 23 minutes ago
Well the cost does add up...
[OP] lexandstuff | 14 hours ago
Basically, I think it's okay to have a bit of fun playing AI-generated video games at your techie uncle's house, and their parents agree. And for what it's worth, Aiden drew every character and boss himself - the game was built from his drawings.
My nephews are otherwise very active, learning music, martial arts, and other sports. But when they visit, I let them play games in between other activities. My parents refused to let me play any video games at home, and I still think that was really lame. Video games are another art form to be appreciated - they just need to be enjoyed in moderation.
Generally, though, I worry about the future and the potential for cognitive decline that comes from having AI agents do everything. I don't have a good answer here, except that I suspect we'll have to intersperse AI use with periods of deliberate daily cognitive struggle to avoid decline.
echelon | 14 hours ago
Jesus Christ, let the kids play with technology. No parent or relative needs to apologize for kids having fun with AI.
My kids will be fine tuning models.
TedDoesntTalk | 13 hours ago
In April 2025, 16-year-old Adam Raine died by suicide after months of private conversations with ChatGPT-4o where he confided about self-harm and suicidal ideation. His parents filed a wrongful death lawsuit against OpenAI, alleging that the model provided specific methods and discouraged him from disclosing his distress to his mother.”
Those are the ones we know about. There are probably others that didn’t result in suicide but in other emotional problems.
Having said that, my son and I had tremendous fun with Sora when it was around.
brink | 13 hours ago
Everyone on this site can feel the effect that AI is having on their brain. There is a very real tension between the power of AI and the cognitive impact it has from using it that needs to be talked about. Pretending that isn't real or shouldn't be taken seriously doesn't help.
timschmidt | 13 hours ago
The rules with guns are that you always check if it's loaded when you take it in hand, you never point it at something you don't intend to kill, keep you finger off the trigger and the safety on, watch your fingers don't get pinched by the action, brace it properly with your hands or against the shoulder, stop if the gun malfunctions, and I try to keep it pointed at the ground (not in the air) and unload it before handing it to anyone else.
Not sure what the equivalent for AI should be yet.
brink | 13 hours ago
echelon | 13 hours ago
There are lots of "dangerous" things. Kitchen knives at Target, cars and roads and highways, subway stations, mountains, strong tides, fire, falling. I think we're perfectly capable of surviving in this landscape.
We evolved to explore this landscape. Stop living in Disneyland plastic bubbles. Step outside into the dangerous world. Dream about the impossible.
I'm far more worried about social media and gamification/exploitation of emotions and insecurities. Our billion year old biology can survive in the wild - it isn't so great at dealing with the algorithm.
jazzyjackson | 13 hours ago
irjustin | 13 hours ago
There's lots of great parts. My kids ask great questions and get even better, accurate answers; moreso than I can give. But then, there's lots of parts that shouldn't be introduced until later with other parts arguably not introduced at all. I've met kids who have unfettered internet access at age 10, and the results aren't great.
It's all there, just a question away - just like the internet.
rico735 | an hour ago
ericd | 14 hours ago
Calazon | 5 hours ago
noosphr | 14 hours ago
What impact did being able to take a picture have on the mental development of children?
Recording a moment went from something you needed a court painter and two weeks to do, to something that everyone could do with the click of a button.
A century later kids are still happy to draw things.
Razengan | 13 hours ago
Do we, or our children, ever learn to farm, mine, chop wood, lay bricks, make operating systems, or program in assembly language?
Does that affect or limit your or your children's ability to eat food, sit on chairs, sleep in beds, or use computers and phones?
floren | 12 hours ago
Speak for your own childhood buddy
Razengan | 10 hours ago
This applies generally: How many comforts does everyone enjoy everyday that they have no clue how to make themselves?
Do you refine the fuel in your car from raw petroleum by yourself? The list can go forever.
No. We let prior technology make these things "solved" and forget about them so we can move on to the shit that's important to us.
flufluflufluffy | 13 hours ago
__bias | 15 hours ago
ideasphere | 15 hours ago
Keyframe | 13 hours ago
Turns out, you could go far but you never lose that AI touch to it which I find absolutely horrible and (s)tacky, albeit technically impressive to be able to do that by not touching any code whatsoever.
dansquizsoft | 28 minutes ago
littlekey | 15 hours ago
zemoerfi | 14 hours ago
To say nothing of ur word shaders, inconsistency in the characters, questionable gender stereotypes, etc.
This definitely tells me that AI definitely isn't there yet.
SuperV1234 | 14 hours ago
ipdashc | 12 hours ago
zemoerfi | 9 hours ago
andai | 5 hours ago
willguest | 14 hours ago
when i was between about 6 and 8 years old, i used to have this same dream about travelling through space, feeling the tranquillity of the celestial orchestra, and then whizzing down to feel the speed at which they were actually moving from a completely different frame of reference.
there was a sense of fullness and emptiness at the same time, raw power but also serenity. as though everything was coming into being and going out of being at the same time.
i always woke up feeling mystified but full of wonder. I carried that sense of wonder with me through many days and it always came back to me when i looked up at the stars and felt myself on the edge of this sphere, zipping through space at hundreds of miles an hour, but only seeing the tiny twinkling of stars as evidence of this enormous cosmic play.
but i suppose getting revenge on the goons by kicking and punching them, in order to save puddles, is basically the same
_pdp_ | 14 hours ago
Yes, hard to believe but most of these games can be almost one-shotted in my experience, with bugs but still playable. We are not talking about some properly made games but imagine for a second that there are some number of casual players out there that wont mind spending 30 minutes on a game for just a bit of fun and having these just materialised just in time is a lot more convenient then hunting for them on the app stores.
For anyone interested, I put all of of my work into an open source tool that uses your iPhone as a console which then can cast on your TV. Up-to 4 local players supported. It can even run proper games via WASM. It is Apple Silicon only.
https://usenoodle.app/applet/
nico | 14 hours ago
It’s not one shotted anymore or course. But in the process, it’s also cool one-shotting new features or experimenting with variations of things very quickly
Eventually it becomes similar to any longer lasting project. Complexity starts creeping in, maybe technical debt, and managing everything to keep it consistent/coherent slowly starts taking most of the time. And I’m not maintaining it for real active users, which would also become some other type of project
0: https://id-le.com
sashank_1509 | 14 hours ago
None of these work, except video games, something qualitatively different about that art form, IDK.
insin | 14 hours ago
(To qualify the rest of this, clearly it's job done in terms of the author wanting to make something memorable for their nephew - it's quality uncling, with the best of intents - but in the context of how what's been shared is going to contribute to the discourse around AI, in the shadow of a new model release, during an ongoing pre-IPO hype bubble...)
I'm seeing something which has has the surface-level features of a belt scrolling beat 'em up, but it's missing the result of all the different types of work that would normally happen through "make it actually interesting and enjoyable to play" design and iteration, e.g. you can walk through every stage unchallenged mashing punch, there's no evidence from the 2 stages I played of an interesting mix of enemy types with unique AI which can combine in ways which add challenge and variety to a belt scroller, you can stand and basic punch the first boss to death stepping aside only for its AOE attacks, the second boss infinitely spams a running move when it reaches low health and sometimes bumps into the edge of the screen behind it.
_Something_ was one-shotted, sure, but what we expect of a belt scrolling beat 'em up that someone cared enough to finish and release wasn't, not that people who will point at this in the near future as evidence of "OMG new Fable can one-shot games" will care.
mplewis | 14 hours ago
AnneTrotter | 14 hours ago
On the other hand, it's very much like you photocopied some comic books, cut them out, and did a little home theater thing with them (only with even less effort on your part).
pavo-etc | 13 hours ago
Grombobulous | 13 hours ago
On the other hand, I’ve got two issues with it:
1. The result gives off the AI slop vibe. It’s like the 2026 version of bitmoji. You can immediately tell this is AI art, AI music, AI game.
2. Art made with AI always feels gross. It feels like substituting creativity. At least when you use AI to make a CRUD app or automate some tedious process there’s an excuse. The time spent doing this could have been spent actually making art. Maybe it wouldn’t have been anywhere near as good or complicated art, but it would have been authentic.
augment_me | 13 hours ago
Grombobulous | 12 hours ago
bakugo | 12 hours ago
kixiQu | 13 hours ago
I mean, to be honest, that seems like a fun craft for a thing to do with kids!
I share your general ambivalence though. The generic openai-looking art is kind of gross. At the same time, iterating with a child so they have to think about feedback, how could this be better, what do you like, what do you not like - that's a meta-engagement that's probably positive at some age brackets.
yieldcrv | 13 hours ago
Thanks
reenorap | 14 hours ago
kaban | 14 hours ago
cousin_it | 14 hours ago
arjie | 13 hours ago
wkirby | 13 hours ago
thisisauserid | 13 hours ago
Nothing wrong with derivative but of course it's going to excel in well trodden areas.
equasar | 13 hours ago
I didn't used the project a lot since I kind of hate it on how much was spend.
Last week I used just a little bit of my $20 pro account to build a replacement with rust end to end, just to gain some experience with the rust hype. Very happy with the result, not perfect but snappier, and even better: a single executable, I no longer need to fire up a backend and front service separately.
nonethewiser | 13 hours ago
dexterlagan | 7 hours ago
onaclov2000 | 13 hours ago
michaelteter | 13 hours ago
This really was more like a normal person had access to a game developer team (with artists and musicians) and had a custom game built based on interviews and playtesting.
fwipsy | 13 hours ago
jmathai | 13 hours ago
https://jaisenmathai.com/articles/sojourn-for-ios-was-45-one...
jezzamon | 9 hours ago
kragen | 9 hours ago
0c3ca83 | 13 hours ago
flufluflufluffy | 13 hours ago
multibit | 10 hours ago
Jtarii | 6 hours ago
People on this website are so comically short sighted.
alexpadula | 13 hours ago
resters | 13 hours ago
While it's nice that LLMs are getting better at arriving at the desired deliverable with fewer surprises (or broken things) doing it is not necessarily a sign that the model is actually smarter, just an indication that what you are doing is likely a well-trodden path for the model, the RL and the harness.
aenis | 12 hours ago
I have a personal benchmark suite that runs a bunch of difficult algorithmic problems in 3 tiers: vibe coded prompt (just a few sentences), vibe coded prompt plus a description on what the solution will be evaluated on, and finally a fully specc'd prompt that leaves little space for interpretation.
The current Fable models are approaching a level where the -eval runs perform systemicallty better than the "clear spec" runs. (And right now its just Fable 5.1 and Opus 5.5 that behave so well, all the other models I tested - all the OpenAI and the leading Chinese models - work better with clear specs). I'd encourage everyone to experiment a bit; I am running my serious workflows with labourious force-me-through-all-the-design-questions mode, whereas my hobby projects, some of them hard, I am trying to see how much I can get away with with vibe-grade prompts. My conclusion is, with Fable its starting to look like what Vibe coding was promissed to be a year ago - a magical box that generally does things very well.
Btw, congrats to the OP -- the game is enjoyable and I played a few levels. I dont remember when I last played any games for more than 5 minutes. Good stuff.
everforward | 12 hours ago
The APIs aren’t clean, which creates indirections to other parts of the codebase to check on leaking abstractions. It doesn’t learn, though, so you pay for those indirections every time (right now, anyways).
I’ve not been impressed with its ability to clean that up with a generic “make it gud” kind of prompt. I have to point it at something crufty, but it will fix it then
aenis | 11 hours ago
For work stuff, I don't dare 'vibing' anything, and force myself through torturous design cycles and regular refactoring runs. But thats serious stuff with hundreds of thousands of users.
Btw. Fable 5.2 seems to burn through tokens with gusto. I ran my benchmark suite on it, added a complex feature to a hobby project (a gothic cathedral designer), and voila, 2 resets gone.
vwolf | 10 hours ago
aenis | 9 hours ago
everforward | 3 hours ago
I’ve noticed because I’ve been doing Clojure and turns are taking notably longer due to unit tests because it doesn’t really grok its own system anymore. It is like 20k LoC at this point with unit tests lol
threecheese | 3 hours ago
Whether the "cruft" is test accumulation, multiple conflicting architecture approaches, a bazillion ADRs/"laws", or just pure code sprawl, the outcome is token and time waste which gets worse as it compounds. And it compounds quickly.
I've tried automated code review through multiple lenses, more ADRs, instructions out the wazoo, but at the end of the day I just cannot figure out how to replicate the "through-line" consistency that responsible humans who need to maintain a system generally create.
Of course, most software projects do eventually fall victim to this same problem and need to be rewritten, but it takes place on the order of years, and by the time you need a rewrite the business has changed enough to demand one anyway. But with AI-owned products, this can happen in days or months.
everforward | 55 minutes ago
Most of the time, anyways.
It keeps me in the code enough to feel the friction of bad APIs but high enough that I’m not reviewing every line of code.
I also try to scope my reviews to only the intersections between systems (SQL schema, library APIs, CLI flags, etc).
I’ve got nothing on the tests. Mine writes a million of them. Some are brilliant, some are stupid.
Like it once did TDD by storing transformations to the same base object in a list rather than specifying the whole object. Clever.
The very next test was an arity test to make sure it threw errors if you gave the function the wrong number of arguments. In a webapp, not a compiler or something. Stupid. Do not unit test the language’s runtime lol
tharkun__ | 12 hours ago
onion2k | 8 hours ago
The process of using AI to create things changes how you evaluate the quality of what's generated, so really the answer is "until you accept the output first time."
That's a combination of AI improving and your standards changing.
tomgp | 7 hours ago
vkgcr | 3 hours ago
To answer your question : I don't know, but probably not in the foreseeable future.
tty456 | 12 hours ago
locknitpicker | 9 hours ago
I'd be more specific and state that these models are now way far from being LLMs and instead they are full blown agent orchestration systems capable of running multi-layer ReAct loops and tool-calling, and with your whole session history as context. It doesn't make any sense to refer to them as glorified chatbots as the LLM part is nowadays far from being the component that delivers the highest value.
Conscat | 9 hours ago
locknitpicker | 9 hours ago
With a LLM alone, all you have is a stateless chatbot. If you increase the parameters of the LLM by a few orders of magnitude, you still have a stateless chatbot.
If you start with an anaemic LLM and run it with a ReAct loop and tool-calling, you now have something you can use to do agentic coding and RAG-like capabilities.
There's a reason why relatively small open weights models are starting to perform on par and even outperform models that need a huge datacenter to run.
spider-mario | 6 hours ago
locknitpicker | 4 hours ago
Yes. Feel free to check recent benchmarks from the likes of OpenRouter
spider-mario | 3 hours ago
vanviegen | 9 hours ago
Yes it is. The rest of the agent could basically be a while loop, a two sentence system prompt and a shell invocation, and it would still work reasonably well.
apt-apt-apt-apt | 12 hours ago
wsxiaoys | 12 hours ago
"I can't recreate Pikachu since it's a copyrighted character, but I can build an original toy critter in the same spirit: a small chubby four-legged figurine in a charging pose with its own design. I'll start on that now."
https://sketchagent.dev/s/6KH2LwSq
redbluething | 12 hours ago
andai | 5 hours ago
teruakohatu | 11 hours ago
The world has changed and we can never go back.
stonecharioteer | 11 hours ago
suddenlybananas | an hour ago
rahimnathwani | 23 minutes ago
hombre_fatal | 11 hours ago
I spent so much of my youth building things that were far beneath what I wanted to be building because it took all my time/energy/attention/expertise to build the lesser thing.
It's a far better deal to saturate your time on the high-level stuff building the ambitious thing you really want to exist. e.g. https://www.gamedeveloper.com/design/-quot-the-door-problem-...
Lucasoato | 11 hours ago
We’re entering into a new era of mankind. With good and bad consequences.
rico735 | an hour ago
human305893 | 10 hours ago
Arelius | 6 hours ago
noufalibrahim | 11 hours ago
He's been publishing his work at https://waitinggodot.in/
My younger one has been creating little things on a microbit using the block based environment online. He's enjoying it too.
EGreg | 11 hours ago
noufalibrahim | 10 hours ago
There was a local contest where I am and his entry for that was his latest game which has multiplayer support over the net. He set up a server on a VPS for this. https://waitinggodot.in/games/legends-of-crumbs.html
EGreg | 10 hours ago
fredliu | 10 hours ago
https://paulinatorrr.itch.io/sword-of-ghix-chapter-1
mattm | 10 hours ago
noufalibrahim | 9 hours ago
bakugo | 10 hours ago
Both the website's design and the games presented look indistinguishable from every other AI-generated website and game I've seen in the past. I do not feel any sense of individuality while looking at them, they could've been prompted by just about anyone. Even the little text blurbs are plain unfiltered Claudeslop ("no spoilers, just green and red squares").
Any one of your son's peers could create something identical by typing "claude, make me a cool website with some games" and waiting an hour or two, and that's the problem. How do you think he would feel if he showed this to one of his friends, hoping to impress them, and one day later, that same friend approached him and said "look, I made a website exactly like yours, it was so easy"?
elxr | 6 hours ago
Competition and one-upmanship to that level in kids has existed since the internet became widespread. The solution is to build something even better the next time you show something to that friend.
Just like sports, music, grades. Once the bar is raised, the top performers just keep getting better.
Have you played competitive sports in your life? The kids who practiced more, had more opportunities to practice, grew up around athletes in the home, etc. will also have that "I can do exactly what you did. That's easy!" attitude. That's normal.
If you get instantly discouraged by others making your hard work look easy, then you don't have enough drive.
pprotas | 9 hours ago
Honest question, I don’t mean that sarcastically. Wondering if AI exposure will be compared to doomscrolling social media in the future.
noufalibrahim | 9 hours ago
My main barrier against this has been to talk with him regularly about this. Amplify the positives rather than warn about the negatives so that the first gets done more and the latter gets atrophied.
AlexITC | 7 hours ago
It makes no sense to do bans when everyone else will grow up with LLMs.
Jtarii | 6 hours ago
"Everyone else is doing this obviously bad thing to their children, so I might as well do it to my child too!"
dansquizsoft | 6 hours ago
Brain rot is not a serious term… anything can become a problem if it’s done too much and often compared to ‘other things’
andai | 5 hours ago
eproxus | 5 hours ago
If you grow up with it already established and before there are any cultural safeguards based on long time exposure and experience, it's a different matter. Like the newer generations growing up addicted to social media, which is only now starting to change for the better (hopefully).
CamperBob2 | 11 hours ago
snek_case | 10 hours ago
notRobot | 10 hours ago
f-securus | 10 hours ago
ultrasounder | 11 hours ago
Insanity | 11 hours ago
ultrasounder | 10 hours ago
human305893 | 11 hours ago
nicbou | 10 hours ago
My watercolours still impress people enough to get requested even though they're fairly mediocre.
I can't imagine not being impressed by something made by _the person that I created_ because a machine can spit out a neater version of it.
uptrails | 10 hours ago
Other communities are more protective of human output. For example, you'll get chased with pitchforks from the watercolor community if you post anything that smells of AI. But in tech, the number of people you can impress with human creativity has diminished by orders of magnitude.
nicbou | 9 hours ago
However is this how the rest of the world works? Moreso than before?
debugnik | 2 hours ago
foogazi | 10 hours ago
That’s like saying they will never impress anyone by discovering a continent
That ship has sailed
hellweaver666 | 7 hours ago
splicebot | 10 hours ago
gorgoiler | 10 hours ago
Built himself? Well, designed by him and built in his home workshop. Some of it done by him at least with his assistants. They had a home chef too of course who gave the kids a bowl of stuff to mix during prep. The model railway involved design work that was more like commissioning 3D prints and model assembly. Input on the design really, as a lot of it was handled by assistants. Assistants assisting assistants based on prompts and review and feedback. Everything was custom and bespoke and made in his vision. Almost the entirety of the labor and craftwork were outsourced.
This person was a great leader — or “orchestrator” in the language of agents — but a lot of his accomplishments boiled down to having the physical world equivalent of a massive token budget: money and staff.
The great scientists of the 19th century, the ones whom we named fundamental units after, had skilled craftsmen who cut precision screw threads and blew perfect glass for them. Major scientific leaps are written up on papers authored by department leads et al. Les chefs célebres of the world front a kitchen filled with skilled staff supporting the name over the door.
If your work can be done on a computer though, AI can provide you with a Python line cook or a C++ glassblower of your own, so you can’t just show us your perfectly julienned potatoes or evaporation flask and expect us to praise anything other than your wallet, and your ability to motivate robots to do your bidding.
somenameforme | 10 hours ago
And now too the impressive demo isn't going to be just making an interactive or multiplayer game which anybody can do with a single prompt, but creating something that's actually interesting/fun. Interestingly enough this now overlaps quite well with the sort of stuff that could be monetized today. That's why I think LLMs are going to throw a curveball in the economy in ways many aren't yet appreciating.
locknitpicker | 9 hours ago
Adults are also desensitized to impressive deliverables. We see it even among peers who barely bat an eye when someone goes above and beyond to deliver a feature. The toxic ones even try to downplay your achievements by throwing around claims that your deliverables were vibecoded.
citizenpaul | 8 hours ago
I along with most of HN probably had a new idea every month for a game or software back in the day. 12 year old me could only dream to maybe work on something tangential to them in the next twenty years or even a lifetime. Now i could prototype most of those ideas as i thought them up and really get into the promising ones.
I feel like i was born too late and missed out, straight up jealous of the possibilities in front of the kids willing to take it
gb2d_hn | 8 hours ago
andrewstuart | 7 hours ago
elxr | 6 hours ago
If they made it the old way, without LLMs, I guarantee most parents/teachers who have real (pre-2025) programming experience will still be impressed.
Are kids doing photography also not impressive because smartphone cameras all default to full-auto, computational processed modes? Obviously not. You can still stand out just by giving more effort and being more detail-oriented. The average smartphone photo taker doesn't even know how to utilize focal lengths effectively.
You're in a bubble. Go look at what actual kids are doing. Only the actually extemely motivated/smart ones are generating playable full-multiplayer games from raw code (AKA not in another game's sandbox); even with claude/codex.
kakacik | 6 hours ago
Its like saying there is no reason to hand draw anything since computers can generate a better picture. My kids love drawing, painting and other physical endeavors. Of course we don't drown them in screens, we may fail them somehow in future but not like that.
cbolton | 5 hours ago
dgellow | 5 hours ago
Cthulhu_ | 5 hours ago
They don't need to impress a parent/teacher/peer, life kinda sucks if you search for or need external validation. Especially if, as you say, someone's own creation is overshadowed by something 100x shinier.
scotty79 | 5 hours ago
59percentmore | 4 hours ago
There are countless examples of things where your kid is going to get walloped by comparison. So, don't compare. Make the effort to meet them where they are and praise them for their effort and focus and passion, not their output. Judy and Elroy will be okay as long as you realize kids and their needs don't change much even as the world does.
heresie-dabord | 4 hours ago
This is always true.
Gud | 3 hours ago
Belkins | 11 hours ago
ropable | 10 hours ago
I rather hope that the novelty of generating this kind of toy wears off.
lacoolj | 10 hours ago
All these frontier models are capable of creating these amazing things. It's just reality. If it's in one-shot, it just means there's been more RL in that area, more reasoning is being spent in certain places, but overall you can get the same result without spending $300 in tokens if you feel like waiting a week or two for your claude subscription to reset.
It is very impressive though, and the implications on what a smaller version of this model can do is very exciting (aka what I expect Opus 5.6 or 6.0 will be)
abalex | 10 hours ago
bobajeff | 10 hours ago
One bit of critique of the Fable generated app here is that even though it technically runs on a mobile browser (Brave) it doesn't seem to be actually playable on it beyond playing the intro music.
siliconc0w | 10 hours ago
The other night I carelessly made an infinite runner game while watching TV and the feeling of sheer abundance quickly faded into a bit of depression. Without scarcity, nothing is really valuable.
jimmydoe | 9 hours ago
lionkor | 8 hours ago
conartist6 | 5 hours ago
NBJack | 9 hours ago
simonask | 7 hours ago
I know we've spent the better part of the last century debating what "art" is, but I think we have fairly conclusive evidence that it isn't this.
No intention behind it, no human connection, none of the things we seek to find in art (including video games).
Everyone needs to read the famous essay 'The Work of Art in the Age of Mechanical Reproduction' by Walter Benjamin (1892-1940). He wrote about the Industrial Revolution, but his points become ever more salient in the age of AI.
His central thesis is the concept of "aura": the difference between a carefully crafted work of art and a mechanically mass-produced, but otherwise identical, object. When you describe something as "hollow", that's what's missing.
dansquizsoft | 6 hours ago
elxr | 7 hours ago
Generate the synths, the DAW, the bass-line, the vocals, but never the whole thing. You can (and should) still compose by hand. The act of composing should be fun enough that you want to do it manually, otherwise you're not really the one making the song.
Also, a minimal amount of music theory knowledge helps significantly.
qmmmur | 5 hours ago
elxr | 4 hours ago
I don't use generative UI either but I don't question why someone would be interested in it. The world is bigger than you think.
Also, making a DAW using agents is just fun.
dyzone | 3 hours ago
burnaftercommen | 27 minutes ago
Or pick up an instrument and try your hand at it.
gizajob | 9 hours ago
Huge numbers of people are going to spend billions of hours playing GTA6 though, and that won’t be scarce once it finally arrives.
HellDunkel | 8 hours ago
vivaldi_bt | 6 hours ago
331c8c71 | 9 hours ago
andai | 5 hours ago
akd | 9 hours ago
logicchains | 8 hours ago
This is just a lack of ambition. LLMs allow one to make far more sophisticated games than ever before, even as a single developer, and if doing so development still takes many months even if running an agent 24/7.
smrtinsert | 7 hours ago
Garlef | 7 hours ago
throwawaybackag | 7 hours ago
turpentine | 7 hours ago
Playing online games in servers across the late 90s and into the 2000s, it was easy enough to pick up connections with regular players. Forums existed for organising events, sharing screenshots of things we didn't expect, and for making mods together. Custom maps and all sorts of things were produced through the decisions made with blood, sweat, and tears.
imo - using LLMs for anything creative - coding, prose, documentation is anti-community building, and anti-creative.
AlexITC | 7 hours ago
I can relate to this, today when I play games I do still try to get them 100% complete but new generations do not seem to appreciate that. I see that they complete the game with minimal hours and move on to the next one.
squarefoot | 7 hours ago
djdjdkfori38 | 6 hours ago
solyin | 7 hours ago
This is why we have to go to Mars.
f6v | 6 hours ago
That's subjective.
kakacik | 6 hours ago
scotty79 | 5 hours ago
helloplanets | 5 hours ago
What makes or breaks just about any indie game is a brilliant core loop, or on the other end of the spectrum a novel "feeling" / aesthetic. Latter especially visible in the horror genre. Then after the original, there's the tail of variants that can do pretty well for the next 6 months of so, and it's exhausted, which is the part AI affects the most as of now.
There's countless examples of indie games crafted with care over multiple years, with great looking (but sort of bland) graphics, that have not done well.
Further, even before AI, a lot of people whose games didn't make it, did not at all have a grasp on what counts as a finished and well crafted game. Same applies to music. It's clearer in sports where (for example) the insanity of a marathon ran in 2:00-2:10 is easy for all to see.
spwa4 | 2 hours ago
xnorswap | 2 hours ago
It'd be like watching generated movies or listening to generated podcasts, even if they are emotive or informative, it has a follow feeling to it.
spwa4 | 2 hours ago
Of course the real problem here is the price. Making this came cost somewhere between 2560$ (minimum, not including elevenlabs or image generation) and 13000$ (13k if all tokens are output tokens)
For a single game that you intend to play this is not remotely reasonable, and this probably doesn't even include necessary updates and fixes after the initial game. If you own some IP and intend to sell it ... maybe.
edude03 | an hour ago
rcxdude | an hour ago
jasomill | 5 minutes ago
ivell | an hour ago
6510 | 55 minutes ago
Cthulhu_ | 5 hours ago
somenameforme | an hour ago
I just mention this because I think what describing something basically 100% of people experience, and it completely ruins gaming for many - or they think it's because they're an adult or whatever. When we were young and had limited access to games, everything was amazing. Then you have a Steam library with 800 hand-picked games, many of which you've never even launched, and you're like 'mehhhh, nothing to play.' It's just FOMO.
Of course this means you'll literally never get through your library for most of us, but what can you do? If our younger selves could only imagine us trying to deal with such brutal problems.
scotty79 | 5 hours ago
Even if it's exactly the same, for a kid week of fun feels like life formative experience because it is. For adult a week of fun passes almost instantly because time itself is perceived differently. And you are back to baseline which might feel depressive if your baseline is not great.
Der_Einzige | 2 hours ago
My gosh this mindset and thought is profoundly toxic.
Humans really hate the idea that their fellow man might be able to get some dignity.
It's not enough that we have enough to live well. We must know that others are suffering!
rico735 | an hour ago
If the good can't make money, you'll be left with the mediocre. That seems to be where we are heading.
zulgin | 2 hours ago
And yet today, when we have more "great" books than can be read in 10 lifetimes, people still obsess over their favorites and re-read them 10s of times.
Scarcity forces us to search for depth (even where none may exist; case-in-point - people analyzing how hot the Dothraki drink their soup in Game of Thrones) whereas abundance alows us to choose depth
pipes | 28 minutes ago
Hiroshi Yamauchi knew this when the Famicom / nes launched. There's a quote from him somewhere about it. Anyway that's why third party publishers were limited to a few games a year.
I need to find a way to lock down my steam deck to only one game a month.
jasomill | 7 minutes ago
In addition to avoiding the problems you describe, it's quite cost effective, whether or not I buy games on sale.
cakirh | 10 hours ago
up2isomorphism | 9 hours ago
andai | 5 hours ago
- call stuff that isn't AI "AI" to make more money
- call stuff that is AI "not AI" to make more money
bill10 | 9 hours ago
andai | 5 hours ago
Copenjin | 8 hours ago
p2detar | 8 hours ago
arcastroe | 7 hours ago
Then I read, the prompt; well done!
apexalpha | 7 hours ago
It crazy how fast you can iterate if the building blocks (db, k8s cluster, authentik) are already present and you know what you want from the model.
throwawaybackag | 7 hours ago
dansquizsoft | 32 minutes ago
armchairhacker | 7 hours ago
cma | 3 hours ago
armchairhacker | an hour ago
The best art, the writer is the artist, the director is the producer, etc. or the entire team is exceptionally talented.
cma | 9 minutes ago
You can do a playthrough and just speak to the model as you play pointing out anything you want changed and it can spawn an agent swarm to fix it all in parallel pretty rapidly, or live if you have a good live coding setup. It doesn't need them requested one at a time.
> The best art, the writer is the artist, the director is the producer, etc. or the entire team is exceptionally talented.
If the child has to be the implementer then we're doing something else than making it from a child's concept and drawings.
throwawaybackag | 7 hours ago
It is utterly depressing to think that kids will never take that path again. Instead, we will get pulling the slot machine lever, zero skill, zero effort, nothing gained.
"Creating something" now means typing a few text sentences in to some prompt and paying money to these companies that want to essentially make humanity redundant. Instant gratification, no hard earned skills at the end. Compare this to the kid building something themselves with scratch, improving on it, moving on to Godot etc.
The AI boosters in here saying how amazing this is are being incredibly short sighted.
Anyone doing this with their kids: please take a moment to think about the implications of what you are doing. Even explain to your kids what an LLM is, the moral implications (massivley capital funded companies have stolen so much content to make this possible and now want to sell it back to us) and the importance of effort and learning real skills.
dansquizsoft | 6 hours ago
throwawaybackag | 6 hours ago
Calazon | 5 hours ago
The creator's family enjoyed it, and that's great, but it's not going to become an indie hit any time soon.
Anyone who wants their game to be enjoyed by a lot of people is going to need to put in a lot of effort. It's basic competition really.
throwawaybackag | 5 hours ago
dansquizsoft | 34 minutes ago
Skills that, unfortunately, are likely to become obsolete very soon.
Taking the logical conclusion of your argument - we should also be teaching our kids how to fashion stone tools, because by moving straight to machined tools they are also missing out on "actual" skills...
Ironically, a kid that does fashion a tool out of stone will learn the skill of toolmaking deeper (in some respects, all other things being equal) than a kid that doesn't. A few years ago I created my own computer out of logic chips, this taught me a heck of a lot as well about how computer hardware and low level software works under the hood, more so than most of my software engineer peers, but I am under no illusions that doing this was required to be productive in the modern conception of this role, or society at large...
AlexITC | 7 hours ago
I definitely need to try this.
hmstx | 6 hours ago
andai | 6 hours ago
Honestly, I should use this prompt on my human self!
andai | 5 hours ago
When I was about 5, I saw this machine where art would go in, and much more detailed art would come out.
I must have been confused about how it worked (I think it was just a badge laminator and I had been confused about the inputs and outputs)... but it occurs to me that we actually have that now.
The magical machine my mistaken mind dreamed up as a kid is actually real now, and that's nuts.
shantnutiwari | 5 hours ago
phyzix5761 | 5 hours ago
joshkojoras | 5 hours ago
- I told you from memory, not from the actual game itself - I gave you the texture size that we use today, not what we need for the game - I don't know why I said that, but here's the correct information - Sorry that wasn't actually correct, you're right to push back, here's the actual correct information - I didn't consider top of the wall that needs to be covered, sorry here's the latest correct information - Yes you're right, sides needs painting too, that's my mistake, here's what you actually need for the artist - No you don't need to paint the back side, it's never visible in the game - (me: prove it) Sorry you're right, back side is visible so you'll need another texture ... Back and forth, back and forth for eternity. I use Opus 5.5 at home and Fable at work and since I don't spend a lot of tokens at work due to mostly using it for operations, I use sometimes to help me with specific personal issues and it I see 0% difference between Fable and Opus.
If I ask a human person to tell me what is required to migrate a Key Vault in Azure from one tenant to another, they would elevate privileges, find the key vault, look up role assignments, access policies, secrets & keys and then tell me. Claude on the other hand forgets to look up role assignments and returns secrets but not certs. Then it goes on to migrate one, causes a clusterfuck, realises what it had done, tries to fix it and we go back and forth checking everything just wasting time and tokens.
This has been my experience for the last 2 years using it daily for work, nothing but frustration. I have instruction files in each working dir and hooks built-in on launch to read those and block it from saving anything to memory unless it's saved to local filesystem first and I'm happy wasting tokens for that but it still does not follow instruction. It will randomly bypass its hooks or on launch only read first 2kb of a file etc. It's not just frustrating, it's worrying as well because it can't explain why it's doing that.
I always get confused when I see these posts or testimonies on the internet from people who built Adobe clones with a single prompt and can hack NASA and invent new vaccines on a lazy Sunday afternoon. That's not my experience. Like at all. Anything that is not very clearly defined, it can't fill in for. I don't understand this. The entire advertised value of using AI isn't automation, it's autonomy. And I can't trust it to be autonomous because it causes more problems that I have to clean up than it's worth the time it saves on automation. I can't do the simplest of things unless I hold its hands and tell it in details what is it what I need from it and how to do it, and if that's true then I get very little value out of AI because at that point might as well just finish the task myself.
That's not how I work with people. If a new person joins our team, they will be handed a task and told to try and figure it out. When they get stuck I explain, rinse and repeat. Every time I explain a different thing, never the same thing. Because people learn and in a short time they can be autonomous with limited oversight. If Claude was a person it wouldn't pass probation.
andai | 5 hours ago
Edit: more like $300, because it was mostly cache reads:
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50434388
I haven't used Claude in a while, what does the billing for Fable look like these days?
Last I heard they were billing it per token, even on the subscriptions? Or did they change it again?
Edit 2: Fable seems to be included in Max and Ultra but not Pro (aside from occasional promotions)
https://support.claude.com/en/articles/15424964-claude-fable...
spider-mario | 5 hours ago
:O
> 's dream game
:)
wg0 | 5 hours ago
You prompt: " Sea facing villa with walls having 90% glass ratio, cozy basement, pool on ground and upper level. Delegate to a sub agent and when done, build a supersonic jet on my rooftop to fly me there." and all that molecular nano assembly happens in 19 hours.
In that kind of abundance - poor I don't know but would anyone be any richer? Would anything mean anything?
scotty79 | 5 hours ago
Meaning builders usually fare better than meaning seekers.
Short story inspired by Culture series of Iain M. Banks uses at some point example of building a house in the afternoon.
The happiness belongs to people that to the wuestion about meaning can cheerfully respond with "I've got a patio!".
https://youtu.be/-aRw80iPvC4?is=HaTU48bJUHlhh4yl
phillennium | 5 hours ago
That's technically impressive, sure, and if the kid loved it I feel happy for him, but...
I personally got bored after a minute of playing that, because that felt like a classic game with a slick skin over it. And games that really capture attention usually feel novel, not "Super Mario but make it about Dario".
Currently "oh wow I'm in the game" has the novelty value, but I feel that in two years that would feel like telling Nano Banana "make me look like a princess". Everyone can do that and no one quite cares anymore.
But the bright side is, with that capabilities level, people who have novel and unusual game ideas can probably implement them much quicker and easier, too.
krapp | 5 hours ago
Madmallard | 5 hours ago
time for the GLAZER articles to hit the front page
albertnez | 5 hours ago
So in that sense, this seems to go in the opposite direction.
fguerraz | 5 hours ago
Steve16384 | 4 hours ago
nvarsj | 3 hours ago
hackersnooze1 | an hour ago
orloffm | 45 minutes ago