Hi Jacob, Ado here, from FounderMail. I'm really glad you ended up on-boarding with us, and I wanted to reach out to thank you for the review and feedback.
The manual approve to outbound sending helped a lot to keep spammers out of the platform.
We ensure that domain exists and you're the owner, the website is legit, etc, making impossible for a bot to operate throughout our channel.
And is working, almost 4 weeks in, no complaints, less than 0.1 bounce rate.
You know, having an high reputation is vital to ensure the emails we send on behalf of our customers are reaching the inbox not the spam folder.
Said that, you continue to be right: it's annoying. We're working to reduce the pain autoapproving it for cases like your.
Thank you again (I hope you'll never find a reason to leave us! :)
Thank you for creating such a great service! It’s always great using a product and getting to thank the developer directly. Your platform seems perfect so far and it was extremely quick to get approved for outbound sending (definitely less than 12 hours). Seems to be working perfectly so far, and I don’t think i’ll be switching anytime soon.
Building a website with Claude is literally "a bot operating on their channels". Whether these are morally equivalent is an unrelated axis - it's the literal claim that's being disputed
I went to your site to check this out, and I found the bright orange from the first slide was killing my eyes, and my coworkers. The other landing page slides were great, the first one made me want to leave.
Overall looks like a great tool that I'll look into for my next projects.
Jacob's blog links to https://foundermail.mx/, I'm guessing you were looking at foundermail.app. I have no idea if they're related, but the former does not burn your eyes, the latter is very bright
It looks fine in sRGB, but I can see how it would be bad with the horrid default profiles that monitors ship with. Graphic designers should really be aware of that at this point.
"I had to submit a special request before I could send emails to new addresses that had not previously messaged me."
sounds even more insane, completely unusable service, I mean if the client sends me automated emails from their system on behalf of the PMs, I would need to submit request to reply to each PM with their individual address? insanity unless they meant domain which would be a bit more sensible
Ditto. The cheapest iCloud subscription includes everything necessary. My partner and I both have emails through our respective personal domains, all on the same sub – I think the limit is 3 custom domains.
The shared hosting package that I bought with my domain 20 years ago from a local hosting company comes with all of these, it cost I think €12/year originally. They got acquired some time ago by a large hosting company who charges more than €120/year for the same package. Then I switched to another local mail provider who charge €40/year (but with more storage). Aren't there many such providers?
There are, but I've seen several of those price increases in a row so you may be moving a lot. And mail deliverability to Outlook and Gmail from those hosts isn't always great.
MXRoute's lifetime plans (which they usually offer around black Friday) are a great option if you can get one. I paid $99 for mine five years ago. The service has only improved since then.
I just looked at their website. Even without the lifetime plan, their pricing makes much more sense to me. You basically pay for the management account and the storage, which is really the thing that cost money.
It never made sense to me that you need to pay for storage per email account, if you use a custom domain. It I use 10GB why should it matter than I have it split over two email accounts?
Protonmail doesn't have unlimited addresses for sending, which is one of his requirements. It has catch-all , which means you can receive from an arbitary number, so it's okay for one -email-per-vendor, but if you ever need to send via one of those addresses then you have to use up one of your 10 or 20 allowed addresses.
This is because like most other vendors, they do price discrimination based on number of users. Which is no doubt why the other large vendors were also ruled out.
One vendor who doesn't do this is Migadu. I don't use them as they lack 2FA support, but they are one of a small number of businesses who make their proposition easy to evaluate quickly, as opposed to making you swipe through a pitch before you get to the facts. This is so unusual that I remember them despite evaluating them multiple years ago.
With Proton and SimpleLogin you can effectively reply through all the aliases. It’s not actually unlimited addresses but I’ve been using it for some time and I find it meets all my needs in a simple clean way. Very happy with the combo.
Simplelogin doesn't do SRS which is pretty bad for this time and age.
That makes emails forwarded from, say, PayPal or ebay marked as scam/phishing in Gmail, AND makes it impossible to report actual spam that comes through.
With a well set up SRS all these emails are recognised correctly. SimpleLogin does some naïve forwarding which messes it up.
I'm migrating out of them exactly for this reason - if I could do it on my hobby server for my personal domains, THEY should be able to do it as well.
> Protonmail doesn't have unlimited addresses for sending, which is one of his requirements.
I can't find that in his list of requirements. He said he wants unlimited addresses, but I'm not able to spot any mention that he wants to send from all those addresses. A catch-all will work just fine for receiving mail, so it may be an option for him.
Yea, Fastmail checks all the boxes, and is well-regarded around here as far as I know. I have used it for something like 7-8 years now and am very happy with it.
Same here. Fastmail is great. The only thing that bothers me is not having a family plan so I can cheaply give my kid his own inbox in due time.
Although to be fair, I welcome competition, and I like seeing people end up with other solutions. I would hate it if Protonmail and Fastmail were the only viable services offering this.
protonmail doesnt even work in 3rd party apps and you can't install their app on Android lower than 10 for some reason (while most of the other email providers have no such problem), wanted my kid to use their email (though kids dont really use email anyway) on heavily restricted old phone, but since protonmail is not interested...
Protonmail has worked great for me. Never had any issues and I like the inclusion of docs + sheets (even though their apps are ridiculously slow to load)
I've got my domain at namecheap, and they just forward all mail to two different pre-existing mailboxes. I configure my mailreader to use my address at my own domain when sending mail, and that works perfectly fine. Sure, headers may show them going through different mail servers, but nobody ever looks at that anymore.
Unpopular opinion, but I've used Google Workspace for years and I really like having my email via gmail. SSO and spam filtering and Google Docs. I thought about switching to Amazon Workmail but the price I pay for Workspace is worth it.
> Unpopular opinion, but I've used Google Workspace for years ...
Not that unpopular. I've used it since way before it was called "Google Workspace" and it Just Works [TM]. Also once you pay for it, suddenly they pick up the phone if you ever need support.
A shitload of SMEs are using Google Workspace to get their own domain and all the Google suite.
I know it's cool to hate on Google on HN but for my part I'll forever be hating on Microsoft and Meta. I tolerate Google.
This and them sunsetting Exchange EWS (which enabled push) was the straw that forced me into looking at other options (the other being them forcing you to pay for Gemini even if you have it completely disabled in your Workspace)
Interesting that self-hosting isn't on his list. It hits every one of his checkboxes and only costs you an old Linux server collecting dust at home (or at most, a $5/mo VPS), which you can also use to host other things.
It's never been easier to self-host, but it feels like, in general, when faced with "I want to do X with a computer," people are more and more reaching for paid, hosted services rather than DIY anymore.
Isnt email blacklisting/actually getting mails to inbox infamously hard? I otherwise think the rest of the stack is indeed solved, but its probably cheaper to pay Amazon SES or whatever for getting your emails to an inbox reliably
Email receivers (be it Gmail or your local council) don't differentiate if you're self hosting or a business. So long as small businesses can manage (who have like one part-time sysadmin that also manages a ton of other IT stuff; email doesn't take much of their time), so can you. If you set up the usual suspects like SPF and DMARC, the domain is not a known spammer, and the IP not in a blocked address range, it's mostly hands-off (source: I self host my email)
If you need it to really be super reliable, yeah, you need to send through one of the big companies who have not just a dedicated sending IP address but entire ranges dedicated to email sending, as well as staff that will respond to delivery issues 24/7. Microsoft rejecting email from Google and vice versa isn't unheard of, so there aren't guarantees anywhere, but that would be your best bet. For my personal use, that extra nine of reliability isn't needed
I’ve actually tried before to self host on my VPS as well as my homelab that I use for various services. I honestly just didn’t trust the stability of my own services enough for something as important as email. As a project I definitely want to try again in the future.
Email is ridiculously resilient to downtime. Exam, for example, will retry by default for several days before giving up on delivering a message.
Even if you don't actively monitor your server and only notice there's a problem after three days of not getting any mail, odds are you'll still receive most of them after fixing the issue.
I haven't spent any real amount of time looking into this, but from the basic research I did perform, I found that well-written guides that aren't grossly out of date are hard to find.
Also, my understanding is that Google, Outlook and other major email services have been implementing as many roadblocks for self-hosted setups as possible to the point where it's a constant battle and difficult to keep up with.
It depends a lot on whether you need the account for reading email, sending email to your own accounts, or sending email to other people. The first two are very easy to self-host.
But agreed that mass-mailing (even account registration style emails) seems a lot less reliable because of those spam filters.
it's only "difficult" because google, microsoft, etc have conivenced the community that self-hosting e-mail is not possible and for some reason, further propetuated by IT influencers that have drank that koolaid.
all complete bullshit; they arbitrraly occasionally block to protect their moat raping privacy. e-mail is the most rewarding self-hosting capability. like anything, there is a learning curve but at the end of the day: it's easy, stable, a pleasure to host. there are solutions that ease the learning curve. after a while, all the e-mail do make it through.
i'm so happy that my communications are not indexed by these hyperscalers.
stop listening to these pussies claiming how difficult it is. they're projecting their limitations.
It didn't help that people are seemingly more offended about the possibility of spam on their inbox than on losing a valuable email due to misclassification.
There's little to no incentive for providers to ever de-escalate.
At my day job, we use Gsuite. I never used it for any non-work purpose, and it wasn't publically published, so any "spam" it got was false positives. Emails I actually needed were being buried below the fold in the spam folder. It turns out there is no obvious way to 100% disable spam filtering (at the time I got the first false-positive at least) so I had to try to just allowlist things that should be left alone.
I've tried this approach, but I found that most email providers aggressively filter out all incoming messages that don't come from validated sources. No matter what I tried deliverability of emails remained very spotty. I did configure DKIM, DMARC, SPIF, etc as suggested. But minimal improvements. Eventually ended up going with AWS SES.
I've had surprisingly good luck the few times I've tried it - but using VPSs that were a bit more spendy and not known to be spamhavens helped, I think.
The cost of something like AWS SES or Postmark is so low as to make it almost not worth it, but it worked; not that I'd trust "real" email to it - but I was surprised that Wordpress setup emails were getting through with little config.
So, there are two main reasons people avoid trying to self-host email, plus a third you only find once you start digging:
1. Deliverability: "the email mafia will flag your emails as spam"
2. Complexity: "configuring and maintaining a mail stack is a technical nightmare".
3. Network blocks: VPS providers and residential ISPs frequently block outbound mail ports (like port 25) entirely or in their terms of use.
I decided we should try self-hosting because some issues with their reliability cost us very expensive problems.
The experience was frustrating anyway, as the weird restrictions on providers caused our setup to be quite bad on some regards -- most notably being forced to use the provider UI to manage some things, which took time and is a non-transferable useless skill, not having users for things that should have had one, etc.
MailCow made the technical setup trivial, blowing objection #2 out.
For #3, we could not rely on stable electricity/internet, so we just spun it up on a reliable VPS provider after a small research.
As for the biggest fear, the IP reputation and deliverability mafia (#1), it is easily solved by routing outbound mail through a simple SMTP relay like SMTP2GO.
You pay based purely on sending volume rather than a flat service fee, and their free tier completely covers small setups.
And how much time did it take? Less than half a day, before AI could do everything for you.
Most paid services charge absurd per-user or per-domain fees for basic features that do not cost them anything.
After 2 years of bad service on paid providers followed by 2 years of flawless self-hosting, there is absolutely no going back.
I self-host email, and it's mostly working. However the problems others have outlined are real: The stack is complicated, even for an expert to set up and keep running. And deliverability can sometimes be a problem, especially to Google who are obviously plotting to monopolise email.
I've been self-hosting (using a server at home) using MailInABox ( https://mailinabox.email ) for around 5 years.
I've been very happy with it. I have a perfectly normal email service, over which I have full control. MailInABox handles all the necessary DKIM etc. I had minor hassles, when I first started, with sending to google and microsoft, but these were reasonably easily managed by following microsoft's advice. (And I have a good ISP.)
The only hassle is that, because MailInABox uses greylisting, initial account-validation emails are sometimes delayed. But because I have control of the service, I can whitelist anything important :)
> There was one annoying limitation. I had to submit a special request before I could send emails to new addresses that had not previously messaged me.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding but this sounds absolutely wild. What?
The founder of foundermail actually left a comment here talking about this. I will likely update the article that it took less than 7 hours to be approved.
I use Migadu(migadu.com), but Apple's iCloud email hosting is basically tailor fit to your expectations, so I don't have any idea why you don't use it.
But you can host your own email too. It's not the easiest option, but it can be done, and there has been some newer email server software written that tries to make it easier.
iCloud email has been part of some sketchy things in the past, supposedly they have been dropping emails with certain words in them with no notification to either side of the message. There isn’t an option to turn it off and it isn’t advertised anywhere https://forums.techsoup.org/t/icloud-email-system-blocks-ema...
I just dealt with this due to the impending termination of .name email. I use a combination of gmail as my mail agent, CloudFlare for the domain, and SMTP2Go for low volume outbound with SPF, DKIM, and DMARC. I don't have any Apple usage or requirements.
Oh, I just remembered that I send mail received by my CloudFlare domain to both gmail and zohomail, and use Thunderbird as the mail agent for the latter.
I use it for outgoing SMTP from my gmail agent, identified as coming from me@mydomain.com ... I added this step because gmail doesn't do DKIM and DMARC, so my emails were being marked as spam by aggressive systems. mail-tester.com rates me at 9.3/10, and the missing points are mostly because my domain is less than 4 weeks old.
Gmail will drop support for sending from custom domains (at least those that aren’t hosted with them) next year btw. That’s why I’m looking for another smtp solution.
In the mean time I’ve checked them (smtp2go) a bit and apparently they do work on having a good reputation and allow you to add them as a smart host to your own smtp server so looks like I’ll give them a try.
I've always ran my own smtp for receiving, I just need something for sending because of the big uns being fully against independent smtp servers. And this being personal mail, i send less than 1000 mails per year.
Resend just kept getting stuck in spam folders for me when sending, maybe I set something up wrong. On their documentation it just says you have to pay for the extremely expensive certificate needed for gmail to trust your messages.
With Google sunsetting support for custom domain in Gmail (scheduled for Jan 2027) I am looking for solutions to sending email from custom domains. Amazon SES works well and is cheap for SMTP.
I want to continue to use Gmail for email storage--mainly because of the awesome search function, but also for longevity--while using a third-party app for pulling specific emails from Gmail and replying to them through my custom domain(s).
The solutions mentioned in this blog aren't that--they have their own storage.
You need to be able to reply to emails sent to your custom domain. So a web app (ideally one I can host myself) that pulls email from Gmail using IMAP and supports configuring SMTP servers for custom domains would be good. Not a fan of desktop apps such as Thunderbird.
Fastmail! Checks almost all of your boxes for US$100/yr. Also supports Apple Mail push. I think that's a good price for premium email and calendar hosting with custom domains!
> At the limit. Once a month's received allowance is used, further mail is refused with a permanent error and the sender is told;
Consider that you may be losing email without knowing even on the cheapest paid plan for $44 a year limits incoming emails to 500 a month. Most people don’t get 500 emails a month, but there can be months when this happens and the emails aren’t even in a “hold” until you upgrade. They’re just completely lost.
I’d rather have unlimited incoming emails than 15 GB or whatever higher storage is offered.
In my experience with emails, if you're not comming from big services like Google, Hotmail etc. The big services will still sometimes flag you as a spam even if you have everything set up properly. They use the monopoly position tohold the email hostage.
I think it's time to seriously consider developing and adopting a successor for email.
I've long wanted a service where every address is routed as a virtual folder as part of one shared domain level inbox for my personal domain. So I don't have to +alias so much or put up with the blocks some sites have on +aliases. E.g. if I shop at Safeway, I can give them <safeway@mydomain.example>, if I log in with Google, I can make the Google account <google@mydomain.example>, etc. Then I want the ability to create labels for actively used inboxes, for example if I have a Costco account, <costco@mydomain.example>, I could give it ans the Safeway email a shopping tag and have that is a secondary inbox, i.e. a hierarchy like <all mail>, then grouped boxes like <shopping>, then select individual inboxes, and finally a catchall inbox for any other inboxes.
I kind of have Google setup this way, but it's a friggin pain (and not really advised) to keep adding address aliases, or having to fight to +alias stuff. So it doesn't quite work.
## A catch all filter designed to automatically organise emails sent to a catch-all address into a folder based on the receiving address e.g amazon@example.com --> INBOX.Amazon
## If the folder doesn't exist it is automatically created
if exists "X-Delivered-To" {
if header :regex "X-Delivered-To" "([^@]+)" {
set :upperfirst "prefix" "${1}";
fileinto :create "INBOX.${prefix}";
stop;
}
}
With some tinkering you can also route arbitrary addresses to plus-aliases (@example.com -> inbox+@example.com, where "inbox@example.com" would be your "main" address). This correctly sorts incoming mail into folders just like normal plus-alias usage would (if those folders exist), but in your inbox, the mail will still show the original mail-to (*@example.com, not the plus-alias version), and when replying, it'll use the correct address (not the plus-alias).
Support helped a lot when I tried to set this up. They initially said it wasn't possible, then came back a while later with a correction.
So close but so far... The subdomain aliasing is neat, but it looks like you still have to create folders manually and also manually configure anything you use as a sending address at the point that you need it.
Too bad the author didn't check Fastmail. It checks all the boxes and on top of that its, imho, the best finished product for mail / cal / contacts and by far.
It may even be my favorite tech product at all. Should I be able to pay for more storage space for the drive (options are very limited), it would approach the perfection.
It's been about 99% fine. I do remember last year noticing that my parent's gmail flagged (an admittedly very short) email of mine as spam, but when she went into her spam folder and told gmail it wasn't spam, all was fine from then on. I think it probably goes a long way to have SPF/DKIM/DMARC correct and doesn't hurt that it's AWS' mail servers.
Just FYI - Any one starting can use - Zoho. They have free tier available and the paid is like $1 a month - if you grow, you can move or grow with them.
I'm not sure about unlimited addresses (probably not), but I've been using Zoho for this for free for years, and I'm pretty sure I set up accounts for my whole family, firstname@lastname.com (how many of them besides me actually used them, I don't know). Works pretty well. I'd guess it's probably limited to like 10 accounts or something, but that's been enough for me. If you (general) don't have quite the same need for unlimited accounts, I'd say it's a good sleeper pick.
adospace | a day ago
The manual approve to outbound sending helped a lot to keep spammers out of the platform.
We ensure that domain exists and you're the owner, the website is legit, etc, making impossible for a bot to operate throughout our channel.
And is working, almost 4 weeks in, no complaints, less than 0.1 bounce rate.
You know, having an high reputation is vital to ensure the emails we send on behalf of our customers are reaching the inbox not the spam folder.
Said that, you continue to be right: it's annoying. We're working to reduce the pain autoapproving it for cases like your.
Thank you again (I hope you'll never find a reason to leave us! :)
[OP] jgx0 | 23 hours ago
bakugo | 23 hours ago
Somewhat ironic, given your entire website is AI generated.
MarcellusDrum | 23 hours ago
handoflixue | 22 hours ago
4b11b4 | 22 hours ago
stingrae | 22 hours ago
shaewest | 22 hours ago
Overall looks like a great tool that I'll look into for my next projects.
phalangion | 22 hours ago
RIP
joshcartme | 17 hours ago
ricericerice | 15 hours ago
If you don't care about your website, why should I?
LiamPowell | 14 hours ago
tallanvor | 13 hours ago
Markoff | 11 hours ago
sounds even more insane, completely unusable service, I mean if the client sends me automated emails from their system on behalf of the PMs, I would need to submit request to reply to each PM with their individual address? insanity unless they meant domain which would be a bit more sensible
[OP] jgx0 | an hour ago
patriciobcs | a day ago
pyuser314 | a day ago
Lalabadie | 23 hours ago
sherry-sherry | 23 hours ago
You aren’t told something has been filtered and it doesn’t go to spam. It’s just deleted with zero recourse. The sender isn’t notified either.
https://talk.macpowerusers.com/t/icloud-mail-what-to-do-when...
I had this happen as recently as June 2026 when my current provider was up. It happens on @mac.com @me.com @icloud.com and custom domains.
newsforb | 23 hours ago
ruuda | 23 hours ago
t0mas88 | 23 hours ago
QuiEgo | 3 hours ago
throwaway093020 | 23 hours ago
asdfqwertzxcv | 22 hours ago
mrweasel | 14 hours ago
It never made sense to me that you need to pay for storage per email account, if you use a custom domain. It I use 10GB why should it matter than I have it split over two email accounts?
Looks really interesting, thank you.
abound | 23 hours ago
[1] https://www.startmail.com/
Muromec | 23 hours ago
EwanToo | 23 hours ago
frizlab | 23 hours ago
zeeveener | 23 hours ago
I am definitely engrossed in the Apple Ecosystem™ though so I can't speak to how it would fit any other setup that isn't almost entirely Apple-based.
[OP] jgx0 | 22 hours ago
Angostura | 15 hours ago
pflenker | 14 hours ago
frizlab | 6 hours ago
ajb | 23 hours ago
This is because like most other vendors, they do price discrimination based on number of users. Which is no doubt why the other large vendors were also ruled out.
One vendor who doesn't do this is Migadu. I don't use them as they lack 2FA support, but they are one of a small number of businesses who make their proposition easy to evaluate quickly, as opposed to making you swipe through a pitch before you get to the facts. This is so unusual that I remember them despite evaluating them multiple years ago.
bl4kers | 15 hours ago
drcongo | 13 hours ago
LazyOne | 15 hours ago
subscribed | 11 hours ago
That makes emails forwarded from, say, PayPal or ebay marked as scam/phishing in Gmail, AND makes it impossible to report actual spam that comes through.
With a well set up SRS all these emails are recognised correctly. SimpleLogin does some naïve forwarding which messes it up.
I'm migrating out of them exactly for this reason - if I could do it on my hobby server for my personal domains, THEY should be able to do it as well.
bigstrat2003 | 14 hours ago
I can't find that in his list of requirements. He said he wants unlimited addresses, but I'm not able to spot any mention that he wants to send from all those addresses. A catch-all will work just fine for receiving mail, so it may be an option for him.
sunbum | 14 hours ago
akshayrajeshwar | 6 hours ago
ok_dad | 15 hours ago
Freak_NL | 14 hours ago
Although to be fair, I welcome competition, and I like seeing people end up with other solutions. I would hate it if Protonmail and Fastmail were the only viable services offering this.
darek | 12 hours ago
iamcalledrob | 14 hours ago
An example of a company that does exactly what I pay them to do and respects me as a customer.
drcongo | 13 hours ago
evanreichard | 3 hours ago
Markoff | 11 hours ago
LatticeAnimal | 23 hours ago
Wowfunhappy | 23 hours ago
cmg | 22 hours ago
Wowfunhappy | 22 hours ago
bigstrat2003 | 15 hours ago
Wowfunhappy | 10 hours ago
adastra22 | 23 hours ago
[OP] jgx0 | 23 hours ago
sherry-sherry | 23 hours ago
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49958660
mcv | 23 hours ago
s0rce | 23 hours ago
65 | 23 hours ago
TacticalCoder | 22 hours ago
Not that unpopular. I've used it since way before it was called "Google Workspace" and it Just Works [TM]. Also once you pay for it, suddenly they pick up the phone if you ever need support.
A shitload of SMEs are using Google Workspace to get their own domain and all the Google suite.
I know it's cool to hate on Google on HN but for my part I'll forever be hating on Microsoft and Meta. I tolerate Google.
nunez | 21 hours ago
This and them sunsetting Exchange EWS (which enabled push) was the straw that forced me into looking at other options (the other being them forcing you to pay for Gemini even if you have it completely disabled in your Workspace)
ryandrake | 23 hours ago
It's never been easier to self-host, but it feels like, in general, when faced with "I want to do X with a computer," people are more and more reaching for paid, hosted services rather than DIY anymore.
tough | 23 hours ago
lucb1e | 22 hours ago
Email receivers (be it Gmail or your local council) don't differentiate if you're self hosting or a business. So long as small businesses can manage (who have like one part-time sysadmin that also manages a ton of other IT stuff; email doesn't take much of their time), so can you. If you set up the usual suspects like SPF and DMARC, the domain is not a known spammer, and the IP not in a blocked address range, it's mostly hands-off (source: I self host my email)
If you need it to really be super reliable, yeah, you need to send through one of the big companies who have not just a dedicated sending IP address but entire ranges dedicated to email sending, as well as staff that will respond to delivery issues 24/7. Microsoft rejecting email from Google and vice versa isn't unheard of, so there aren't guarantees anywhere, but that would be your best bet. For my personal use, that extra nine of reliability isn't needed
[OP] jgx0 | 23 hours ago
probably_wrong | 14 hours ago
Even if you don't actively monitor your server and only notice there's a problem after three days of not getting any mail, odds are you'll still receive most of them after fixing the issue.
probably_wrong | 10 hours ago
zeeveener | 23 hours ago
Also, my understanding is that Google, Outlook and other major email services have been implementing as many roadblocks for self-hosted setups as possible to the point where it's a constant battle and difficult to keep up with.
cosmotic | 23 hours ago
handoflixue | 22 hours ago
But agreed that mass-mailing (even account registration style emails) seems a lot less reliable because of those spam filters.
waynesonfire | 22 hours ago
all complete bullshit; they arbitrraly occasionally block to protect their moat raping privacy. e-mail is the most rewarding self-hosting capability. like anything, there is a learning curve but at the end of the day: it's easy, stable, a pleasure to host. there are solutions that ease the learning curve. after a while, all the e-mail do make it through.
i'm so happy that my communications are not indexed by these hyperscalers.
stop listening to these pussies claiming how difficult it is. they're projecting their limitations.
hakfoo | 22 hours ago
There's little to no incentive for providers to ever de-escalate.
At my day job, we use Gsuite. I never used it for any non-work purpose, and it wasn't publically published, so any "spam" it got was false positives. Emails I actually needed were being buried below the fold in the spam folder. It turns out there is no obvious way to 100% disable spam filtering (at the time I got the first false-positive at least) so I had to try to just allowlist things that should be left alone.
GianFabien | 22 hours ago
bombcar | 15 hours ago
The cost of something like AWS SES or Postmark is so low as to make it almost not worth it, but it worked; not that I'd trust "real" email to it - but I was surprised that Wordpress setup emails were getting through with little config.
woolion | 14 hours ago
1. Deliverability: "the email mafia will flag your emails as spam"
2. Complexity: "configuring and maintaining a mail stack is a technical nightmare".
3. Network blocks: VPS providers and residential ISPs frequently block outbound mail ports (like port 25) entirely or in their terms of use.
I decided we should try self-hosting because some issues with their reliability cost us very expensive problems. The experience was frustrating anyway, as the weird restrictions on providers caused our setup to be quite bad on some regards -- most notably being forced to use the provider UI to manage some things, which took time and is a non-transferable useless skill, not having users for things that should have had one, etc.
MailCow made the technical setup trivial, blowing objection #2 out. For #3, we could not rely on stable electricity/internet, so we just spun it up on a reliable VPS provider after a small research. As for the biggest fear, the IP reputation and deliverability mafia (#1), it is easily solved by routing outbound mail through a simple SMTP relay like SMTP2GO. You pay based purely on sending volume rather than a flat service fee, and their free tier completely covers small setups. And how much time did it take? Less than half a day, before AI could do everything for you.
Most paid services charge absurd per-user or per-domain fees for basic features that do not cost them anything. After 2 years of bad service on paid providers followed by 2 years of flawless self-hosting, there is absolutely no going back.
rwmj | 14 hours ago
drpixie | 12 hours ago
I've been very happy with it. I have a perfectly normal email service, over which I have full control. MailInABox handles all the necessary DKIM etc. I had minor hassles, when I first started, with sending to google and microsoft, but these were reasonably easily managed by following microsoft's advice. (And I have a good ISP.)
The only hassle is that, because MailInABox uses greylisting, initial account-validation emails are sometimes delayed. But because I have control of the service, I can whitelist anything important :)
subscribed | 11 hours ago
I self hosted my email domains for 15+ years. Finally got fed up with the constant trickle of the maintenance and got a service for everything.
Not quite happy with that as they don't even do SRS (implying they do), but i guess I'll just migrate elsewhere.
The upside is I've got more time for myself and have less CVEs to worry about.
Self hosted apps migration in progress; I guess I'll leave media, book and file server only, off the internet, and that's it.
red-iron-pine | 6 hours ago
other self hosting? sure.
bastawhiz | 23 hours ago
Maybe I'm misunderstanding but this sounds absolutely wild. What?
[OP] jgx0 | 23 hours ago
wh33zle | 23 hours ago
zie | 23 hours ago
But you can host your own email too. It's not the easiest option, but it can be done, and there has been some newer email server software written that tries to make it easier.
[OP] jgx0 | 22 hours ago
jibalt | 23 hours ago
Oh, I just remembered that I send mail received by my CloudFlare domain to both gmail and zohomail, and use Thunderbird as the mail agent for the latter.
nottorp | 15 hours ago
If you run your personal mail on this and not automated notifications it's basically free, but how many spam lists are this kind of services on?
jibalt | 14 hours ago
nottorp | 13 hours ago
In the mean time I’ve checked them (smtp2go) a bit and apparently they do work on having a good reputation and allow you to add them as a smart host to your own smtp server so looks like I’ll give them a try.
jibalt | 3 hours ago
nottorp | 2 hours ago
skeptrune | 23 hours ago
internet2000 | 22 hours ago
[OP] jgx0 | 21 hours ago
fortran77 | 22 hours ago
ohcmon | 22 hours ago
Big benefit of this combination is that you get "login with google", docs, drive, hangouts
[OP] jgx0 | 22 hours ago
ivanjermakov | 22 hours ago
Can even send email, although recipient sees that it has been forwarded.
flowerlad | 22 hours ago
I want to continue to use Gmail for email storage--mainly because of the awesome search function, but also for longevity--while using a third-party app for pulling specific emails from Gmail and replying to them through my custom domain(s).
The solutions mentioned in this blog aren't that--they have their own storage.
joshcartme | 17 hours ago
flowerlad | 9 hours ago
nunez | 22 hours ago
newscracker | 20 hours ago
Consider that you may be losing email without knowing even on the cheapest paid plan for $44 a year limits incoming emails to 500 a month. Most people don’t get 500 emails a month, but there can be months when this happens and the emails aren’t even in a “hold” until you upgrade. They’re just completely lost.
I’d rather have unlimited incoming emails than 15 GB or whatever higher storage is offered.
po1nt | 16 hours ago
rsingel | 15 hours ago
https://support.google.com/mail/answer/22370?hl=en
Fine for small needs.
And then when bigger pay $5 a month per email address to a decent provider. At that point, you're spending more energy to save money than it's worth.
raffraffraff | 14 hours ago
higeorge13 | 10 hours ago
Glyptodon | 14 hours ago
I kind of have Google setup this way, but it's a friggin pain (and not really advised) to keep adding address aliases, or having to fight to +alias stuff. So it doesn't quite work.
joefarish | 14 hours ago
Here is my script:
require ["fileinto","imap4flags","variables","regex","mailbox"];
## A catch all filter designed to automatically organise emails sent to a catch-all address into a folder based on the receiving address e.g amazon@example.com --> INBOX.Amazon ## If the folder doesn't exist it is automatically created
if exists "X-Delivered-To" { if header :regex "X-Delivered-To" "([^@]+)" { set :upperfirst "prefix" "${1}"; fileinto :create "INBOX.${prefix}"; stop; } }
sakjur | 14 hours ago
https://www.fastmail.help/hc/en-us/articles/360060591053-Plu...
Vingdoloras | 13 hours ago
Support helped a lot when I tried to set this up. They initially said it wasn't possible, then came back a while later with a correction.
Glyptodon | 6 hours ago
builder_woody | 14 hours ago
hypfer | 14 hours ago
> This post placed #4 on HackerNews
Did you want to talk about your custom email domain, or the meta game of the HN algorithm? It can't really be both
consp | 14 hours ago
ranguna | 14 hours ago
Fwirt | 14 hours ago
armenarmen | 6 hours ago
pjerem | 14 hours ago
It may even be my favorite tech product at all. Should I be able to pay for more storage space for the drive (options are very limited), it would approach the perfection.
tallanvor | 13 hours ago
notpushkin | 13 hours ago
potato-peeler | 13 hours ago
Email is one service that should be accessible from any machine.
BBrooks96 | 13 hours ago
alance | 11 hours ago
https://alexlance.blog/email.html
[OP] jgx0 | 10 hours ago
alance | 10 hours ago
agnishom | 11 hours ago
https://namecrane.com/store/email-hosting-deals
mumin00 | 10 hours ago
kolli_kumar | 10 hours ago
rglover | 10 hours ago
wonderfuly | 10 hours ago
icodestuff | 4 hours ago
batperson | 4 hours ago